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Couple Video Clips

Jameel - 3-14-2004 at 03:56 PM

Here are a couple clips I recorded from a lecture on Arabic Music with Simon Shaheen in Minneapolis last week. It was a fantastic experience. I don't have much extra space on my server, so these clips will only be up for a few days. I hope you all enjoy them.

Clip 1

Clip 2

mavrothis - 3-14-2004 at 05:14 PM

thanks so much for the clips jameel, they're great!!

mav :applause:

s shaheen

jeanluc - 3-14-2004 at 05:20 PM

thanks Jamaal...
it's not so often that we can see him play.... :xtreme:

btw, do you know what kind of rishas he uses?
thks

Thank you Jameel

sydney - 3-14-2004 at 06:14 PM

:bowdown:

I was wondering how to save your clips to my PC please. ?

Cheers mate

Emad

Saving Clips

spyrosc - 3-14-2004 at 06:22 PM

Jameel, thanks so much for everything you are doing ! Fantastic.

Emad, to save on your PC right-click (the opposite of what you normally do) with the mouse, and when the small menu shows up, select "Save Target As" and save the file. It should be a .wmv file which you can play with WINAMP or other player.

spyrosc

sydney - 3-14-2004 at 06:27 PM

Thank you for your help, I actually did itthat way but it does not save the file to my PC it only saves a link. how can I save it and be able to play it when I am off line?

Thanks

Emad

oudman - 3-14-2004 at 07:37 PM

awesome clips, i have yet to see another guy out there with simons technique

Mike - 3-14-2004 at 07:47 PM

Sweet stuff Jameel. He is a stud!!! You were lucky to be able to check him out in such a cozy environment. Loads of fun, I'm sure.

Zulkarnain - 3-14-2004 at 09:09 PM

Hi

Jameel..thanks for sharing that with us! Mr Shaheen Oud is amazing (not too mention his playing!) Do you have any details of that particular oud? Do you know what strings he use?

Thanks again Jameel!

LeeVaris - 3-14-2004 at 09:58 PM

Awwwwwe....some!

Brian Prunka - 3-14-2004 at 10:13 PM

Simon uses pyramid lute strings, which he orders in specific gauges, not the "oud" set.
I've seen him use all kinds of rishas, including plastic, but when he performs he almost always uses horn.

zeyad - 3-14-2004 at 10:42 PM

Thank you Jameel.
zeyad

Zulkarnain - 3-14-2004 at 11:35 PM

Thanks Brian!

jeanluc - 3-15-2004 at 04:39 AM

thanks Brian,

horn risha and Nahat make a unique pair when in good hands...eventhough great players could play with anything....

Ronny Andersson - 3-15-2004 at 08:24 AM

I have never understood Shaheen greatness as oudplayer.

Multi Kulti - 3-15-2004 at 08:31 AM

What do you mean Ronny?

Brian Prunka - 3-15-2004 at 09:08 AM

Hi Ronny,
who do you consider to be a great oud player?

bluesyOud - 3-15-2004 at 09:34 AM

Wow !!!!!!
really good stuff!!!!!

Multi Kulti - 3-15-2004 at 09:36 AM

I think that personal taste cant be seriously used by someone who makes a critic....

I personally DONT like so much Arabic oud-school.I love turkish style...but i cant say that players like Farido,Abdel Wahab,Bashirs (from Iraqi school),Simon Shaheen,Abadi,Adel,Marcel Khalife,Naseer Shamma and soo many others NOT GREAT oudplayers are...

Nikos

Jameel - 3-15-2004 at 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ronny Andersson
I have never understood Shaheen greatness as oudplayer.

Which of Shaheen's albums/live performances have you heard?

spyros mesogeia - 3-16-2004 at 03:45 AM

Dear friends,
I have three albums of Simon Saheen,
I like him very much and I can say for sure that It is considered as one of the greatest oudplayers....
Only the album Al Qantara can show the virtuosity of this person....
Some people when say something about this artist should be more carrefull....they have many many things to learn by him....
I saw a student of him that he works now here in Greece on the Greek television,and I can asure you that he has many elements of Saheens style...
Respect to this great teacher,sometimes the arrogance has limits....
Regards
Spyros
P.S.Jameel my friend thank you very much for your kindness to share with us this wonderfull videos

oudman - 3-16-2004 at 04:02 AM

you dont have to love the arabic-school of music to appreciate simons greatness, you just have to appreciate music. only an ignorant person, mr multi, would not understand that

Zulkarnain - 3-16-2004 at 04:08 AM

Hi

Whats going on?? Did I miss anything?? :bounce:

Regards

Oud Greatless

Jameel - 3-16-2004 at 06:06 AM

I never imagined that my offering of these two clips would result in an argument, or negative commentary. It wasn't easy holding a video camera the entire time Simon was lecturing and playing. (two hours) I would have MUCH RATHER sat there and enjoyed it, but I knew that it would be worth it. I'm appreciate that those of you who like them took the time to comment. I'm not 100% on whether these can be saved to your hard drives (I'm new to video), but I'll be taking these off line in a couple days to free up more space on my server.

Zulkarnain - 3-16-2004 at 06:11 AM

Jameel

I love your video man....if nobody likes it...dont bother...send it to me ok...I love this lesson...its inspiring really!

Regards

Oud Greatless

bluesyOud - 3-16-2004 at 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by spyros mesogeia
Dear friends,
I have three albums of Simon Saheen,
I like him very much and I can say for sure that It is considered as one of the greatest oudplayers....
Only the album Al Qantara can show the virtuosity of this person....
Some people when say something about this artist should be more carrefull....they have many many things to learn by him....
I saw a student of him that he works now here in Greece on the Greek television,and I can asure you that he has many elements of Saheens style...
Respect to this great teacher,sometimes the arrogance has limits....
Regards
Spyros
P.S.Jameel my friend thank you very much for your kindness to share with us this wonderfull videos

Spyros who is the man of Greek Tv you are talking about?
Tell if you want ofcourse? :applause:

mavrothis - 3-16-2004 at 06:47 AM

Hi Jameel, thanks again for posting these clips. So you know, I was able to save them on my hard drive no problem.

If you need me to repost them for you, let me know.

mav

spyros mesogeia - 3-16-2004 at 08:16 AM

Dear friend,
The name of this person is Alexandros,he is very good,now he works for the Nathion Greek radio and television....
He did visit my teacher Nikos Saragoudas and my teacher told me that he is very very good.....
I want to contact him too , I want to ask him a few things about the Simon's technique...

I will let you know when I will contact him
Regards
Spyros

Brian Prunka - 3-16-2004 at 08:20 AM

Oudman, I think Multi Kulti was saying that although he isn't a big fan of Arabic oud playing, he still recognizes the greatness of the Arab players.
There are so many styles of oud playing, maybe we shouldn't argue about whether we prefer Arab/Greek/Turkish/Armenian/Bachir styles. There are excellent musicians playing in all these styles, regardless of what anyone prefers.

btw, Jameel, i saved the files fine, too. Thanks for going to the trouble of filming/posting.

Zulkarnain - 3-16-2004 at 08:22 AM

I save it fine too!

Thanks Jameel!

Regards

Oud Greatless

David Parfitt - 3-16-2004 at 08:51 AM

Hi

Well said guys - just because we do not enjoy listening to a particular oud player does not mean he is no good. Saying that, it is good to be critical and debate the merits of particular players (this is supposed to be a forum, after all) - but only if we have some evidence to back up our argument.

Also, how do we define 'greatness' when it comes to oud players? Some players must obviously be better than others, but is a player's merit based on peer acceptance, technique, innovation, etc? Is there a particular point in their career when they can be said to have achieved 'greatness'?

Best wishes

David

Ronny Andersson - 3-16-2004 at 08:58 AM

David, Simon Saheen himself is not gentle with his own comments over other musicians and he has right to say what he wish. If yourself spend some time with professional oudplayers, then you would hear lot of opinons that arn't always gentle.

David Parfitt - 3-16-2004 at 09:05 AM

Hi Ronny

I can certainly believe what you say. However, I am not sure professional oud players are always the best people to be judging other professional oud players, as their judgement may be clouded by jealousy, rivalry or whatever.

Can you give some more details about your views on Simon Shaheen, so that we can get a good debate going here? You don't have to be too gentle!

Best wishes

David

Multi Kulti - 3-16-2004 at 09:07 AM

Of Course i meant that I DO appreciate all the players.Arabs,Iraqis,Turks,Armenians and others...

And i said that because i felt a little bit uncomfortable with the critics of Ronny about Simon Shaheen who is without doubt one of the best in his age...

Nikos

10 out 0f 10

sydney - 3-16-2004 at 01:59 PM

Jameelo Jameelo

Thank you man for sharing these clips, I have managed to save them to my PC. Hey they are lovely and I believe Simon can play with his hands in his pocket. :xtreme:

Good on you mate

God bless your good heart. keep it up

Emad

Jameel - 3-16-2004 at 02:39 PM

Salim Dayatuk to you all. I'm glad you all enjoy the videos. (Well, almost all

)

Ronny Andersson - 3-17-2004 at 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David Parfitt
Hi Ronny

I can certainly believe what you say. However, I am not sure professional oud players are always the best people to be judging other professional oud players, as their judgement may be clouded by jealousy, rivalry or whatever.
Can you give some more details about your views on Simon Shaheen, so that we can get a good debate going here? You don't have to be too gentle!

Dear David, certainly not. I've seen to many flamewars on the web like Farid contra Nasser and each oud player seems to have a hysterical fanclub who can't take any critique what so ever.

Regards,

Ronny

Zulkarnain - 3-17-2004 at 01:33 AM

:wavey:

Does Mr Shaheen have a Fan Club anyone?

Oud Greatless

Video Clips

wfspark - 3-17-2004 at 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zulkarnain
Jameel

I love your video man....if nobody likes it...dont bother...send it to me ok...I love this lesson...its inspiring really!

Regards

Oud Greatless

Jameel the clips are great! I didn't think this would start an uproar. Simon Shaheen is top noch. He's got wonderful technique, and though the Arabic school in my mind is hard to understand, I still enjoy it. People need to be just a little more open minded. I like all kinds of oud. Weather it's Turkish, Arabic, or African, I love it. Thanks for the clips.

William F. Sparks

Zulkarnain - 3-17-2004 at 08:16 AM

:applause:

Oud Greatless

Brian Prunka - 3-17-2004 at 10:41 AM

I've spent a fair amount of time with Simon, and I rarely have heard him criticize another oud player, except in the following situations:

someone asked him directly what his opinion of a particular oud player is, and he responded bluntly and honestly. Ronny's right, he's not gentle.

when discussing a particular piece, he might say that a particular player's interpretation is not traditional or has mistakes, etc. if it comes up, so that a student doesn't copy those mistakes.

I have heard that he was a little more, um--outspoken when he was younger . . .

re:flamewars/opinions/criticism/greatness:

Ronny, I think that this discussion has taken a defensive turn beacuse your original post was not so much an actual critique, but rather a cryptic statement without any details. :shrug:

If you had said, for instance, that you think Simon overuses his technical ability, or is too predictable, or whatever else your criticism is based on, I think people would have responded in a more positive discussion. But maybe not.
I personally think Simon is great, but I'm not a "hysterical fanclub" member ( :bounce:

) who is closed to honest criticism (I came up with the above examples, didn't I?).
However, the way in which you chose to dismiss Simon clearly implies a disrespectful attitude towards the people who appreciate his playing--is it any wonder that people are irritated about it? :mad:

the internet message format has a way of distorting things sometimes; the way it came across is as if you thought that people who like Simon are fools. I don't think you meant it that way, really (or maybe you did, I don't know) :shrug:

I'm not surpised that you don't particularly like Simon, since you are obviously really into the Iraqi style of playing. It's not my favorite, but I'm glad that for some people it is, because that creates more musical diversity. I still enjoy it, though--it's still an oud, after all. And, I might add, i think you're really good at it. :applause:

I think we can discuss our opinons about various players, but we should do it in a way that respects other's opinons, because there's a fine line between criticizing a player and criticizing the people who like him.

No hard feelings, i hope?

peace,
Brian

ps. I know the "smilies" are kind of lame, but they're helpful in keeping the message from being too serious . . . I mean, it's the oud, people! We all love the oud, we have more in common than not, even if we disagree about our favorite players.

Ronny Andersson - 3-17-2004 at 01:47 PM

Brian, after all I was to harsh and cryptic. I have strong opinions and I've been in to oud music since I was 14 now 38

. so I'm not a youngster like many of you ¨guys¨ and I've got the same haircut as Mike...I belive they call it for the oud style.. :cool:

Well, I'm not a great fan of Simon when I consider him as a greater violinist than oudplayer - well there I go again. Anyhow, I know that Mike don't want flame wars so lets be friends...
:xtreme:

Let's be friends.

wfspark - 3-17-2004 at 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ronny Andersson
Brian, after all I was to harsh and cryptic. I have strong opinions and I've been in to oud music since I was 14 now 38

. so I'm not a youngster like many of you ¨guys¨ and I've got the same haircut as Mike...I belive they call it for the oud style.. :cool:

Well, I'm not a great fan of Simon when I consider him as a greater violinist than oudplayer - well there I go again. Anyhow, I know that Mike don't want flame wars so lets be friends...
:xtreme:

Hello To all. Like Brian said, let's all be friends. Yes, we may have our opinions on different styles of oud playing and different players, but we don't need to start a war about it. I'm a new oud oficionato, and the only two styles I know are the African style, and the biblical Hebrew style. That doesn't mean I disrespect other players. To be honest, I think Mr. Shaheen is top notch in oud playing. He has to be my favorite along with Udi Rant. The point of my message is to be a little mor open minded, and respect other's opinions. I have no grudges against anyone. You guys are great! Thanks.

William F. Sparks

Jameel - 3-17-2004 at 05:05 PM

"Udi Rant"

Now there's a name destined for an argument.

Zulkarnain - 3-17-2004 at 05:42 PM

Im 33... Jameel how old are u? and u Mike? TP21? elrabee? Yazoal? Mavrothis?

Oud Greatless

TruePharaoh21 - 3-17-2004 at 06:18 PM

I may be the youngest, but who knows. I'm 18 right now. (And a picture of me is soon to come in the appropriate post as soon as I finish finals).

Hope all is well with you guys.

TP21

mavrothis - 3-17-2004 at 06:37 PM

Cool Zul, I'm 24.

mav

Zulkarnain - 3-17-2004 at 09:57 PM

Hi

Well, I guess Ronny is right...he is the eldest among us

and we are all youngsters (am I Mike?

) Im going to get my hair cut "The Oud" style now...cya later friends!!

Oud Greatless Fans!
**Mav and Yazoal I think both of you should get your hair cut "The Oud" style too!

Brian Prunka - 3-17-2004 at 10:50 PM

Ronny,

I'm glad we're friends now . . . no more flame wars. And on your last statement, i agree . . .
I'm curious how you got into the oud at such a young age. I was 22, now 28 . . .

Jameel - 3-18-2004 at 05:04 AM

30. But I was bald 7 years ago!! :mad:

Zulkarnain - 3-18-2004 at 05:59 AM

Hi

Jameel...its ok my friend..at least its the "Oud" style look u got there...right Ronny?

Salam

Ronny Andersson - 3-18-2004 at 06:06 AM

That's right Zul. :xtreme:

Mike - 3-18-2004 at 06:40 AM

We are all always friends here. And Jameelo, you ain't the only one bro! It's good genes my man.

Oh, I'm 32, going on 33 in a few months Zul, but I'm not gonna call you Uncle Zul, ok.

Be good all,
Mike

Zulkarnain - 3-18-2004 at 07:11 AM

hmmm... :mad:

Oud Greatless Fans
***born 29 Nov 1971-hehehe I bet u are older than me now huh bro hahahaha!!

Oldest?

LeeVaris - 3-18-2004 at 09:44 AM

I think I've got all you kids beat – I turned 50 this last June!

Still a youngster on the oud though.. had my 3rd lesson last week, been playing since January.

I'll post some mp3s so you can all have a good laugh as soon as i figure out a microphone set up for my computer!

javascript :icon(' :airguitar:

Ronny Andersson - 3-19-2004 at 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brian Prunka
Ronny,

I'm glad we're friends now . . . no more flame wars. And on your last statement, i agree . . .
I'm curious how you got into the oud at such a young age. I was 22, now 28 . . .

It's was by an coincident; I tried guitar when I was 12 I think (I never liked it). I
preferred classical music and one day when I was listening to the radio, it was a
live concert with Bashir - he was in Sweden….Later I decided to get an oud and what a hell I had to find one..a poor Egyptian made oud. But it was fun and I did my best and after very short time I met an Iraqi guy (also one totally insane Swede) who played oud (luck or?). But he moved and died….so after that I never had any more lection.
:airguitar: