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danieletarab
Oud Junkie
Posts: 213
Registered: 1-18-2009
Location: Palermo (Italy)
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"E""?
Listen.. The most important thing that you have to do now, it's preserving your oud for damages!! Otherwise you will have to throw it away and it
would be worse than waiting 1 or 2 weeks.
1) keep in mind that the typical, classic tuning is, from the thinest to the thicker cc \ gg \ dd \ aa \ gg \ c (or d).
THan you have the iraki tuning, which start on F and it's also very used, but you ABSOLUTELY need proper F strings to use it, and I would also say, a
proper oud designed for F tuning.
TUning strings higher than they are supposed, it's EXTREMELY dangerous and the sound you get it's horrible.
Please, take off your strings, order LA BELLA and wait.
Be aware that there's also another tuning, which is the turkish one and it starts from D\ It's used only in turkish music as far as I know.
La Bella produces strings for C tuning, D tuning, and F tuning\ So, pay attention and get the right La Bella set, that as far as I remember is LA
BELLA OU 80, or something like that (for the tuning in C).
If you have any problem, any other doubt, or troubles to put the strings don't hesitate to ask me or anybody else, but take care of your nice oud.
2) I don't understand the attitude of your teacher: a good teacher should teach only what he really knows\
Oud is not an instrument among others..
Where do you live? can't you get any oud teacher in your area, even only for a couple of lessons?
3) to put the string, if you don't find an oud player a classical ntlon guitar player may help..
Take care of you and of your oud..
daniele
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
Posts: 28
Registered: 5-6-2010
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I am currently installing the extra strings that came with the oud. and ill update on what happens.
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1865
Registered: 7-25-2009
Location: San Francisco, California
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E? That's SCARY.
Ok, maybe offer him and that guide dog of his some sleeping pills to loosen them up? But then ask him to play a little in Saba. Has it occurred to
you that maybe he doesn't know anything about the oud?
Believe the people here, we have no motive other than helping you and your oud.
Yes! Those two nylon courses are right for a C tuning
0.033" tunes to g (2nd course)
0.026" tunes to c (1st course)
you remove all the old strings and start stringing from the first course and I assume you have the diagrams that show which pegs go to which strings?
The most common way I have seen is this, as seen from the top of pegbox
If you have some peg compound this is a good time to put a bit on the pegs.
6
5a. 5b
3b. 4b
3a. 4a
2b. 1b
2a. 1a
=======
Nut
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Sazi
Oud Junkie
Posts: 786
Registered: 9-17-2007
Location: Behind my oud
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Mood: مبتهج ; ))
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Interesting, but I believe this is the most common way to attach the strings...
http://www.oudcafe.com/images/arabic%20stringpeg.jpg
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Aymara
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1162
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Location: Germany / Ruhr Region
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That makes me believe, that he is a guitar teacher and knows absolutely NOTHING about the oud !!!
There is a variation of the standard arabic tuning CFAdgc which leads to the 5th course (double string) being E (instead of F), so that the four inner
courses are like on the guitar CEAdgc.
If you like you could try this tuning too, without any risks.
But as said before, every tuning that goes higher than the standard CFAdgc is a risk with standard oud strings.
Tune with the software we mentioned here and make shure you don't tune higher as said before ... lower is no problem, but higher might result in a
damage, be it the strings or even the oud.
The thickest bass string will be shown as C2 in AP Tuner, the next F2, then A2, D3, G3 and the thinnest string as C4. You see ... the higher the
number the higher the octave/note.
And you will notice, that it takes a few days until the strings have settled and stay in tune. The first two days the strings will detune very fast,
especially the two naked nylon courses.
Yes, but like I posted (links above) before, there are several different ways in which order to place the strings in the peg box.
But I think it's best to stay with the standard as long as one isn't experienced enough to understand, why it might be an advantage to do it different
Greetings from Germany
Chris
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1865
Registered: 7-25-2009
Location: San Francisco, California
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Sazi,
Are you saying there's a difference??? take a look
Isn't what I diagrammed is exactly what's on the photo?
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5a. 5b
3b. 4b
3a. 4a
2b. 1b
2a. 1a
=======
Nut
For the Arabic tuning
1 = cc Nylon 1st, highest, course, 1a is highest string
2 = gg Nylon
3 = DD Wound (some like plain nylon for 3rd course)
4 = AA Wound
5 = FF Wound (or some like EE)
6 = C Wound lowest single course (sometimes tuned to D)
 no?
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Sazi
Oud Junkie
Posts: 786
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Location: Behind my oud
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Mood: مبتهج ; ))
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Haha, must be going blind in my old age
Thanks for pointing it out!
Actually I just re-checked what it was I thought I saw in your explanation... for some crazy reason I saw the letters as being the courses!!!
wtf!?!
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
Posts: 28
Registered: 5-6-2010
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THX , a lot of help. But i play a lot of calm songs form lets say oum kaltoum like hob eih abd ba3eed 3annak. So what is the best tuning for those
kind of songs?
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1865
Registered: 7-25-2009
Location: San Francisco, California
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Mood: m'Oudy
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Arabic.
My group is planning to take on a limited number of apprentices this year for coaching and exploration, in order to enhance their lives. This will
offer exposure to many of the things you are interested in. There are two essential qualifications which applicants must meet, of which you seem to
amply pass the first. As to the second, let me ask you, point blank, are you wealthy?
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Aymara
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1162
Registered: 10-14-2009
Location: Germany / Ruhr Region
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As Fernand said, start with the standard arabic tuning CFAdgc. That should work for most purposes and can be changed later, if needed.
We will see in which direction you will develop yourself.
For the beginning the above mentioned tuning should be fine ... I use it too, though I play Europian music ... it seems to be fine for nearly any kind
of music.
Here it is again ... Fernand's wonderful humor
Greetings from Germany
Chris
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
Posts: 28
Registered: 5-6-2010
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LOOOOOOOL
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ameer
Oud Junkie
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One thing to note is that some of those older songs may be tuned down a half or wholestep. In that case you can either transpose it or retune your
oud; tuning down doesn't heart and is in my opinion something every oud player should try at least once. To echo what Fernand said we blind people can
change oud strings quite well sometimes which makes string experimenting addicting. You'll likely begin experimenting with them once you get
comfortable.
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Aymara
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1162
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Location: Germany / Ruhr Region
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Quote: Originally posted by ameer  | | tuning down doesn't hurt and is in my opinion something every oud player should try at least once. |
I read several times, that many ouds do sound much better, when not tuned to A = 440 Hz, but a bit lower.
BTW ... I read about a thesis, that tuning to A = 432 Hz would be ideal, because that's based on C = 128 Hz, which has something to do with sense of
balance of the human ear. Hard to explain in English.
But I think this is a bit too mch for an early beginner?
Greetings from Germany
Chris
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ameer
Oud Junkie
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I won't say it's better or worse, only different.
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
Posts: 28
Registered: 5-6-2010
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Hello all, well we installed the strings that came with the oud. They feel and sound much better but they need fixing every couple of hours so im
still waiting for them to work . My tuning is FF,CC,GG,DD,AA,E .
what do u guys think?
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ameer
Oud Junkie
Posts: 458
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I see three possibilities:
1. The measurements on the strings are wrong: I'm sorry, I just can't see a .026 tuned to a high F.
2. Your oud's days are numbered: if you try to tune a string set designed for C tuning to F then something is likely to give.
3. You're using Turkish notation: as I recall Turkish notation shifts up a fourth so what we call C becomes F.
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
Posts: 28
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ok but thats what my teacher plays with. u think i should tune it to an arabic tuning?
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Aymara
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1162
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Location: Germany / Ruhr Region
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I think this tuning is way to high and it will very likely damage your oud ... I fear, it's just a matter of time.
If you want to use such a high tuning, you should have bought a turkish and not an arabic oud. You can tune a turkish oud to an arabic tuning, because
it is lower, but you can't tune an arabic oud, which is designed for a low tuning, to a turkish or similar high tuning ... the resulting tension of
the strings causes to much stress to the bridge and so to the soundboard too.
What was written on the package of the strings regarding the tuning they were designed for? Wasn't it CCGGDDAAFFC or CCGGDDAAGGC ???
As a compromise for you and your teacher I would recommend using CCGGDDAAEEC ... ask your teacher, if that's acceptable for him. You'll loose the high
FF, but the rest is identical except getting a deep C
PS: With the LaBella 12-string arabic set everything should work fine ... just use only one string of the deep FF course and tune it down to E and you have
your desired tuning without any risks.
Greetings from Germany
Chris
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
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ok guys thx ill ask him if he will change the tuning to CCGGDDAAEEC
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
Posts: 28
Registered: 5-6-2010
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well , my oud sounds horrible with the new strings. It doesn't even sound like your supposed to be playing it. It sounds like you use it for
decoration. I dont know when i started playing i was so excited because i used to watch the oud players on tv and the internet and they sound so nice.
But my oud sounds so lame. Im getting discouraged . My teacher says that the tuning FF,CC,GG,DD,AA,E is a ''new tuning'' and everyone uses it. But my
oud sounds like crap.
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Aymara
Oud Junkie
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Location: Germany / Ruhr Region
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That might be the new hype tuning in his town, but it is not a common internationally used tuning, as you can see HERE
| Quote: | | But my oud sounds like crap. |
I only can repeat myself:
So I would order and try the LaBellas. With these strings you loose the risk of damaging the oud because of too high string tension and you might win
a much better sound.
But the later needs a bit more explanation.
The tuning FFAAddggccff, which the LaBella 12-string set is designed for, is mainly used on Iraqui floating bridge ouds, where this tuning sounds
great.
On a "standard" arabic oud with fixed bridge it is likely, that the standard tuning CFFAAddggcc sound better.
So we have three factors, that influence the sound characteristics of an oud:
1. the oud's design and quality
2. the quality of the strings
3. the strings tuning
Conclusion: The LaBellas are good sounding strings, but it might be, that your teacher's tuning doesn't sound good on your oud even with good
strings.
PS: I have the impression, that you are a fan of deep sounding arabic ouds ... and your tuning is too high to come close to this desired sound.
Greetings from Germany
Chris
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1865
Registered: 7-25-2009
Location: San Francisco, California
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Dear Ezz
I don't get it. You keep complaining about your oud, asking questions and then seemingly doing the opposite of what several people here are telling
you, then coming back and complaining some more. It feels hopeless.
Simple solution: go to ostrie music supplies Web site and order one Arabic oud set PLUS the high ff "mumtaz" string pair. Set aside the fattest string
and you have a 6 course set suitable to the "new" tuning your teacher likes.
http://ostriemusicsupplies.com/marioud-ar.htm
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Sazi
Oud Junkie
Posts: 786
Registered: 9-17-2007
Location: Behind my oud
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Mood: مبتهج ; ))
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Just a thought, but maybe your teacher is from Sudan?
I don't have too much Sudanese oud music, but what I do have all uses the tuning you mention Ezz, but I have no idea what strings they use, though
it's possible that it comes from using guitar strings.
Ali has been experimenting with a guitar E string for the bass F on a 57cm oud, and says it is a bit tight for playing on but sounds great open.
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
Posts: 28
Registered: 5-6-2010
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I tell my teacher what you guys have been recommending but he goes on and tells me that this is the right way. I can't really tell him off because he
is a friend of the family. Im a big fan of deep sounding arabic ouds. We changed the strings to better quality. He gave me the oud with dirty prints
of it. scratches , chips. And he is playing me. He didn't even change the last 3 strings. THE ONES I WAS COMPLAINING ABOUT. Once i got to lebanon my
father knows an old man who used to play oud on the streets and then was incited on a television show, maybe he can help me.
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Ezz-the-oudplayer
Oud Addict
Posts: 28
Registered: 5-6-2010
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Btw, my teacher is egyptian. he recently started playing oud, he is mostly a piano player and uses the piano to tune my oud. I try tuning my oud to
the recommended tuning u guys gave me but it is extremely hard . I don't know if i should tune it to C or C#.
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