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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
Registered: 1-30-2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Ideal Oud Pickup
Hey Everyone,
I've recently come across a pickup which is, in my opinion, ideal for oud. I'm going to try to record some sound clips and post them soon, so if you
were thinking of adding a pickup to your oud, you may want to hold off a little longer.
Who makes this pickup? Patience, my friends . . . I don't want to say just yet.
I am talking to the company and it looks like I will be able to soon offer them on my website. And of course, I will offer the best deal I can to my
fellow mikeoudis.
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
Registered: 1-30-2004
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Okay, here's a sample I recorded.
This is with my Sukar electric oud. The electronics from Sukar didn't work when I got it, and his quasi-floating bridge design sounded terrible, so I
had John V (Bulerias) fabricate a new bridge and clean up the leftover parts of Sukar's bridge.
It is shallow, with a flat fiberglass back. It sounds okay, but by no means a great oud. I think it sounds very good for what it is, but it's not
like I would record with it, this is strictly for performing. So keep in mind the limitations of not using a great oud to begin with.
Here are photos of the oud
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
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Here is the sound file.
I simultaneously recording with the pickup direct into the computer and with a condenser microphone, and the recording switches between the two
sounds.
The first 19 seconds are just the pickup plugged directly into the computer with no effects (no eq, no reverb, etc.).
From 19-32 seconds is the condenser microphone.
From 33 seconds on, it's the pickup again (starting where it jumps up the octave).
Starting where I play Longa Nahawand, I added a bit of EQ and reverb.
sample
Try to listen on decent speakers to get the best picture of the sound.
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adamgood
Oud Junkie
Posts: 499
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got this when going for the sound file...
Sorry! That page doesn't exist.
What you're looking for is probably at http://www.nashazmusic.com
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
Registered: 1-30-2004
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Sorry about that! The link is fixed now.
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Sasha
Oud Maniac
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Location: San Diego, California
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Mood: No Mood.
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...and which link is that, Brian?
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
Registered: 1-30-2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Mood: Stringish
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This one:
Quote: Originally posted by Brian Prunka  | Here is the sound file.
I simultaneously recording with the pickup direct into the computer and with a condenser microphone, and the recording switches between the two
sounds.
The first 19 seconds are just the pickup plugged directly into the computer with no effects (no eq, no reverb, etc.).
From 19-32 seconds is the condenser microphone.
From 33 seconds on, it's the pickup again (starting where it jumps up the octave).
Starting where I play Longa Nahawand, I added a bit of EQ and reverb.
sample
Try to listen on decent speakers to get the best picture of the sound.
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paulO
Oud Junkie
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I listened on headphones, and the differences between the sound of the Mic, and the pickup are very close. Looking forward to more info.
Cheers..Paul
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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I just realized that because of a loose wire when I recorded, that there is a rattle on the pickup recordings (the wire was touching the soundboard
and rattling from the vibrations). That sound is ordinarily not there, I will try to record a cleaner version when I get a chance.
If you consider that a performance would have the sound coming out of speakers, they give a little better sense of the real-world sound application
than headphones . . . the differences are exaggerated a bit by headphones, IMO. Not a huge difference, but noticeable.
As you can probably tell, I'm pretty excited about this pickup, mainly because I finally feel like I have a pickup I can perform with. I've tried
lots of them over the years and never been very happy with the sound.
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Multi Kulti
Oud Junkie
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Mood: skaataa!
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Very natural treble and bass sound..i listened on both studio monitors and headphones and i loved the sound of it.
Im really waiting for more infos about this pickup..i would love to test it on my ouds and compare it to my setup (Akg C411-FishmanProEq-AERamp)
Nikos
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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Nikos, it is funny you mention that, as the AKG411 is what I have been using as well. I like its sound quite a bit, but I always felt like its
midrange was a bit unnaturally overemphasized. Still, it works well live, because of the tendency to cut through. I will try to record a sample with
that mic as well for anyone who wants to compare.
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MatthewW
Oud Junkie
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Brian- please don't keep us in suspense too long buddy on this oud pickup, as you know many of us here are always on the lookout for that elusive
animal! 
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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I just want to get everything confirmed with the company before I spill the beans . . . soon!
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spyros mesogeia
Oud Junkie
Posts: 896
Registered: 9-10-2003
Location: WASHINGTON DC
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Mood: play my ouds
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Hello Brian,
I use Schertler products,let me know when it's available,I would like to see it and try it.
Regards
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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It looks like 90% sure I will be carrying the pickups soon. They are made by B-Band, a German company who has developed their own proprietary pickup
technology. It is not a piezo (like Fishman, PUTW) or a contact mic (like K & K).
While obviously nothing can replace a great microphone, the B-Band technology sounds more like a microphone than anything else out there that I am
aware of.
The pickups come with an output jack that has an integrated preamp. If your oud doesn't already have an output jack, it will require that a hole be
drilled somewhere (end block is best).
It also has a small volume control thumbwheel and requires a 9V battery. For this reason, it will likely not be practical if your oud has a rosette.
The thumbwheel needs to be mounted somewhere and the soundhole is the best place (though you could just turn it up all the way and put it somewhere
where you can't adjust it), and while the batteries last a long time, you probably don't want to take your rosette out even once a year to do it.
I will let you guys know when I have some available.
cheers,
Brian
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spyros mesogeia
Oud Junkie
Posts: 896
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Location: WASHINGTON DC
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Mood: play my ouds
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
Registered: 1-30-2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Mood: Stringish
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I'll also mention that you can get a version that includes a condenser soundhole mic (you mix the mic and pickup), or if you have a guitar-type
bridge, there is an under-saddle version (you can mix the two kinds of pickup).
They used to offer an outboard battery, which may be a solution if you have a rosette. I'm not sure if it's still available, but I'm looking into
it.
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MatthewW
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1031
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Spyros- which model Schertler do you use?
Brian- For those with rosettes, would you know if the B-Band can be fitted and made to work without the thumbwheel by some sort of modification...and
so instead of the soundhole thumbwheel work just as well with an external preamp? Perhaps the manufacturers might be able to shed some light on
this?
How is the feedback tolerance with the B-Band ? Have you tried using it at various volumes- from small venues to larger live performances? etc? thanks
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Matthew,
They unfortunately do not offer an option for an external preamp, and I don't think any modification would be a good idea given what I've seen of the
design.
They do offer a more involved onboard preamp which would involve more modification to the instrument--mounting it somewhere on the bowl.
The best solution would be to just install it with the volume all the way up and control the volume externally with a volume pedal or small mixer,
IMO.
They are no longer officially offering the external battery system, but they told me that there is a workaround--I don't have the details yet.
I do wish that they offered an external preamp, but it doesn't look like that will happen in the forseeable future.
I've used it at moderate to high volumes without feedback (as long as the speakers are not pointed at the oud and you're not right next to them). I
haven't tried extremely high volumes . . . I suspect that you might have some issues, but less so than using a microphone. If you really need to play
oud with Black Sabbath or something, I think the Godin Multioud or other piezo system is really the only viable option.
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adamgood
Oud Junkie
Posts: 499
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Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Ah, B-Band! Someone was telling me about these very recently, who or where it was completely escapes me! Maybe someone in Germany while I was still
living there. The idea of the long thin strip soundboard transducer is very appealing.
Still freaky for me the idea of drilling into my instrument to make a hole for a jack so I've been using a putty stick on Schertler (Basik) behind the
bridge and with a Baggs pre. Working for me though I'm not in love with it.
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spyros mesogeia
Oud Junkie
Posts: 896
Registered: 9-10-2003
Location: WASHINGTON DC
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Mood: play my ouds
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I use UNICO with Dyn G.
Regards
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
Registered: 1-30-2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Mood: Stringish
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| Quote: Originally posted by adamgood | Ah, B-Band! Someone was telling me about these very recently, who or where it was completely escapes me! Maybe someone in Germany while I was still
living there. The idea of the long thin strip soundboard transducer is very appealing.
Still freaky for me the idea of drilling into my instrument to make a hole for a jack so I've been using a putty stick on Schertler (Basik) behind the
bridge and with a Baggs pre. Working for me though I'm not in love with it. |
I agree--I am not going to be drilling holes in my Nahat or al-Mulki bowls! Those instruments are for quieter performances where a mic will suffice
(though I can put the AKG 411 inside the Nahat temporarily without modification).
From my perspective, if the gig is loud/noisy enough to require a pickup, the subtle nuances of the great instruments will be lost anyway, which is
why it makes more sense to devote a less valuable instrument to it.
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paulO
Oud Junkie
Posts: 531
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Location: California
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It is a great sounding pickup, and I would want to try one - but since they have no way of externally powering their end-pin pre-amps, I'll have to
pass.
Regards..Paul
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
Registered: 1-30-2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Mood: Stringish
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| Quote: Originally posted by paulO | It is a great sounding pickup, and I would want to try one - but since they have no way of externally powering their end-pin pre-amps, I'll have to
pass.
Regards..Paul |
Paul, check my earlier statement:
| Quote: | | They are no longer officially offering the external battery system, but they told me that there is a workaround--I don't have the details yet.
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Alan-TX
Oud Junkie
Posts: 118
Registered: 2-18-2008
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Any update on this Brian? I have a Sukar I want to install one of these on if they are available.
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