hartun
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turkish lyrics help old 78 rpm gesi baglari
I know this is a long shot but can anyone make out the Turkish lyrics being sung here: https://soundcloud.com/harry-kezelian/kesinin-baghlari-atma-anam. I got this off of an old 78 rpm record. The song is the well known Gesi Baglari,
here titled as "Kesinin Baghlari (Atma, Anam)". However what I'm hearing in this 78 dosen't seem to match up with any of the lyrics I could find
online (and there are a lot), except for the refrain "Atma, anam atma, su daglarin ardina...etc."
What I can make out is
Kesinin baglari.........
Anam.....................
Anam.....................
............................
Atma anam atma su daglarin ardina
Kimseler de yanmasinler, anam yanasin ...... (derdime?)
.............................
............................
.............................
Bana da......................
Atma anam atma su daglarin ardina
Kimseler de yanmasinler, anam yanasin...........
In other words, i couldn't make out much!!!
In any case enjoy the recording. According to the Spottswood guide this was recorded in New York in 1917 by Armenians Merdjan Garabet Effendi [Garabet
Merjanian] (oud and vocals) with Kemani Minas Effendi (violin) and an unknown kanun player. Kemani Minas was also a popular singer who made many
recordings. The 78 simly credits Merdjan Garabet Eff. Interesting to note that the nakarat on this doesn't show up in any other recordings of the song
I have heard.
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hartun
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ok i have made out some more of the song. if anyone could help me further that would be great.
https://soundcloud.com/harry-kezelian/kesinin-baghlari-atma-anam
Kesinin baglari.........
Anam.....................
Anam.....................
............................
Atma anam atma su daglarin ardina
Kimseler de yanmasinler, anam yanasin ...... (derdime?)
...............................ter
Atesim yanmadan anam tutunum tuter
Atesim yanmadan anam tutunum tuter
Bana da bir hal oldu olumden beter
Atma anam atma su daglarin ardina
Kimseler de yanmasinler, anam yanasin...........
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reminore
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unfortunately...it's tough. a little searching of phrases all lead me to a song called gesi baglari, from the kayseri area...but a practical
transliteration- uuugh. i can read along with what you have and that's about it...the lyrics seem to be what in greek (maybe in english too, i don't
know) orphan phrases...that seem to turn up in unattributed songs...and often don't make much sense as far as continuity...
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hartun
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Costa I know what you are talking about. I've also seen them referred to as floating verses. In reference to rebetiko songs. They are common in
English folk songs as well especially blues. I guess what's bothering me the most is the refrain that keeps coming up "atma garip anam atma su
daglarin ardina/kimseler yanmasin anam yansin derdime"...I can't understand the meaning of this although I know most of the words .thanks for taking a
look at it. I found a lot of variations to the song on turkish websites but I can't seem to make out the first verse of the recording although I made
out part of the second verse. I even found a website with a 100 stanza version of the song.....
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reminore
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well...
the lines you write above to me read something like...
'poor mother (garip) don't shoot at the earth of the mountains,
even if no one else does, my mother will burn with my pain...
bana da bir hal oldu, olumden behter (i'm in a state better than death)
atesim yanmadan, anam tutunum tuter ( my mother burns/smokes my tobacco without my flame burning)
all of these are highly idiomatic fragments that certainly mean something specific to the are they come from...tough! but i like a challenge...
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hartun
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I think the word "anam" here is just am exclamation....with the exception of atma anam atma..because its in every stanza at the same place...so maybe
"my tobacco burns without my fire setting it aflame" ?? Yes it sounds like an idiomatic phrase. And isn't the other "I'm in a state worse than death"?
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reminore
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going by your trasliteration, beter (spelled in ottoman turkish behter) is from the persian and means...better! (one of those good old indo european
cognates!). so the meaning 'better than death' is correct, assuming that the word is correct...i need to go back and listen to it when i have some
time...
i don't agree about anam...there are too many songs referring to 'mother' - in greek and turkish both - and just in this kind of context...no one
loves me like my mamma...
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hartun
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you are right there are a lot of songs referring to mother in turkish greek and armenian. but i still think the word "anam" is not a proper part of
the sentence, for example with the most famous verse to this song, on the turkish webisites its written as:
Gesi bağlarında dolanıyorum
Yitirdim yarimi aranıyorum
Bir çift selamına güveniyorum
Gel otur yanıma hallerimi söyleyim
Halimden bilmiyor ben bu yari neyleyim
but in real life they sing....
Gesi baglarinda dolaniyorum
Yitirdim yarimi, ANAM araniyorum
Yitirdim yarimi, ANAM araniyorum
where the "anam" is not in the written lyrics
i spoke too loosely, we don't have to consider it a "filler" word, obviously the use of the "anam" has a deep emotion to it but my point is even if
its not a filler word its an exclamation and not operative within the sentence, so not
"my mother burns my tobacco without my flame burning"
but
"without my flame burning, oh mother, my tobacco smokes"
something like that??
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oudmaker
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Guys,
ANAM soppose to be AMAN
Additıonal verses:
Gesi bağlarından gelsin geçilsin
Kurulsun masalar rakı konyak içilsin
Herkes sevdiğini alsın seçilsin
Atma aman atma beni dağlar ardına
Kimseler yanmaz ANAM yansın derdime
Gesi bağlarında bir top kar idim
Yağdı yağmur esti rüzgar eridim
Evvel yarin sevdiği bir ben idim
Gel otur yanıma hallerimi söyleyim
Halimden bilmiyor ben o yari neyleyim
This old and beautiful folksong is from KAYSERİ-Turkey
My old Armenian friend who was from Kayseri used to dance with it and tought how to my kids. God bless his soul
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hartun
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Dincer, thanks for the extra lyrics. I knew the song was from Kayseri thats why I was interested. All of my dad's grandparents were born in Fenese
(Develi, Kayseri).
I am surprised to hear that the Armenians danced to this song. It doesn't seem like a dance song, because it is sad. I suppose they could dance a very
slow "bar" to it. I will have to ask people about that.
Was your friend from Kayseri city or one of the villages? I suppose it is too much to ask to describe the steps of the dance....
I have another recording of an old Armenian man in Detroit "Sam the Tailor" singing the song. My friend's grandfather recorded this man in the 40s or
50s. He says:
Gesi baglarindan gecemiyorum
Az doldur kadehi annem icemiyorum
Kara kasli yardan gecemiyorum
Atma garip annem atma karli daglar ardine
Kimseler yanmasin annem yansin derdime
then he starts singing a faster song. maybe you have heard this. i have never heard it anywhere else. i dont know turkish properly so most of it I am
making up what the words sound like...
yavas da yavas bastan gel
dagda lar uynarmadan
pencereyi asta gel
de ismadan duymadan
ah disinler disinler
......disinler
kaymakami (?!) nerede
kiz oynasi disinler
"disinler" is maybe "düzünler" ??
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oudmaker
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hartun
i am not going to send any answers to your questions because you have inserted an unnecessary and unfortuned statement which is not in line with the
purpose of this forum.
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hartun
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Dincer, I assume you are referring to my mention of the Armenian Genocide? I am truly sorry if you were offended by that. The only reason I said this
was to explain my suprise at your statement that an Armenian you knew used to dance to "gesi baglari". I did NOT mention it to bring up a discussion
of the events of 1915 which as you said is not the purpose of this forum.
Let me further explain myself. I did not say anything that I believed was offensive to you. I realize you are a Turk but I have expressed no bad
feelings toward Turkish people as individuals or as a group. I merely mentioned that Armenians connected a certain sad song with the suffering they
experienced in 1915, at the hands of the ITTIHAD VE TERAKKI (not at the hands of the common Turkish people). I suppose you are right that this is
still not an appropriate thing to discuss between Armenians and Turks on a forum dedicated to music where we should be coming together in a friendly
way.
I trust that you are a good and honest person, so, if you say you are offended by the mention of those events in this forum I will no longer mention
them in conversation with you and I apologize for doing so. I'm sure this is a misunderstanding, please, let's not be enemies over this. I am content
to not mention this again and to delete the mention from my previous comment in this thread.
Harry
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reminore
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very disappointing response on your part dincer bey....especially since i very much enjoy your very intelligent and knowledgable posts.
i've re-read the posts a number of times, and see nothing 'unnecessary or unfortunate',nasty or nationalistic anywhere...
i would hope that the scope of the forum is something more than discussing string gauges and the shape of oud bowls, but also encompasses the music
and the cultures that relate to the oud and the music played on it.
the genocide of 1915 dominates the armenian reality worldwide up until today - i'm sure we can discuss the relative merits of dwelling on these events
to no end - but there it is - it is an all encompassing fact accepted many people - whether you accept it or not.
why is the tone of your last post so strange - what, are you going to punish the readers by withholding your explanations to points being
discussed?
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hartun
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Costa I appreciate your coming to my aid but I will give Mr Dincer the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps he has some personal reasons for not wishing to
discuss the Armenian Genocide. But you are right in that my comments should not to an average person be divisive or controversial or even
inappropriate to this forum even if that person is a Turk. In that sense I take back what I said about this not being the place for such a comment.
Because my only comment was that one Armenian I know connected the song Gesi Baglari with the genocide. As you correctly pointed out, the genocide of
1915 is an established historical fact, however I did not mention the Genocide to discuss its history or the politics surrounding it and certainly not
to insult the Turks as a whole or Mr Dincer as an individual. I simply said some Armenians considered this song an expression of their suffering in
those times, suffering which two of my great grandmothers underwent as well. That being said I have no interest in dwelling on the subject and would
welcome Mr Dincers response to my original questions.
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maran
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hartun, sent you a u2u.
Thanks,
Paul
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