rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Perfection Pegs on my Copcuoglu Oud
Hello, finally after having seen Mustafa Said playing an oud with geared pegs I decided to go for it and did some research. There are not that many
choices: Wittner from Germany, Perfection Pegs from Australia and Lauffer from Germany.
The first and the last are made of ABS plastic whereas Perfection pegs are available with ebony or rosewood knobs in Swiss or Hill style.
Because of aesthetic reasons I went for ebony Hill style knob Perfection pegs. Accidentally the holes in my Copcuoglu oud were almost right. I just
reamed them a tiny bit with a 1:30 reamer and it was a no-brainer to install the pegs. I was glad to be able to use the electrical saw in Sebstian
Stenzel's workshop for shortening the pegs to measure.
I'm absolutely content with the optical result as well as with the way how they function. This this effect one sometimes has: 'Why in the world didn't
I do it earlier?'
It's just so convenient and tuning is so easy and smooth. The tuning is maintained very well after the strings have settled.
And Simon from Perfection Pegs is a very nice and helpful guy. I suggested to create oud sets of pegs to make the thing more attractive for oud players and they
are considering it.
Here is a front view in detail ((c) Paul Jaroslawski)
[file]31288[/file]
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
And here the front view of the whole oud ((c) Paul Jaroslawski):
[file]31290[/file]
|
|
|
hussamd
Oud Junkie
Posts: 117
Registered: 12-18-2013
Location: Bartlett, IL
Member Is Offline
|
|
Looks great! Very nice. Geared pegs would be too heavy and will throw the balance off, plus they do not look right on the oud.
The cost of the pegs and the reamer will be over $260, ouch!
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
These pegs do not weigh significantly more than the original pegs I was using made from ebony. There is no change in balance! And the oud sounds
better than before, which was found not only by myself but also by my luthier friend Sebastian Stenzel.
I don't think anybody would be even able to recognize that they are geared pegs without close inspection and some knowledge about these pegs.
The cost is high, indeed, but the advantages are also great. I don't think cost is a reason to dismiss them. People spend a lot of money on less
important things like ornamentation and fancy materials. This is well invested money!
best
Robert
|
|
|
hussamd
Oud Junkie
Posts: 117
Registered: 12-18-2013
Location: Bartlett, IL
Member Is Offline
|
|
I meant the guitar style pegs like the ones in the Godin MultiOud or some of the new ouds from Turkey with a guitar neck. The ones you used are a
brilliant substitute. I found a video on Youtube that detailed installing it for a violin.
I totally agree with you they are worth it.
|
|
|
bulerias1981
Oud Junkie
Posts: 763
Registered: 4-26-2009
Location: Beacon, NY
Member Is Offline
Mood: John Vergara Luthier Lord of the Strings instrument making and repair
|
|
I've installed these pegs for some clients. I like them, although, if pegs are fitted well, with quality materials, peg shavers are properly razor
sharp, a good set of pegs is great.
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by bulerias1981  | | I've installed these pegs for some clients. I like them, although, if pegs are fitted well, with quality materials, peg shavers are properly razor
sharp, a good set of pegs is great. |
Agree, but still it's sooo much better ...
|
|
|
Mike
Super Administrator
Posts: 1568
Registered: 12-3-2002
Location: California, USA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy
|
|
Hey Robert,
Just picked up some of these for Maurice. Just curious...what size did you use? I got Mo one set (i.e. 3 sets of 4) of the 9.0mm, and a few of the 8.5
and 8.3. The 7.8 is the most common, but may be too small for an oud. These are really great pegs, and in my opinion well worth the price. Lee Varis
put these on his Egyptian oud back in 2004, and absolutely loved them. That oud had poorly fitted olive wood pegs. Installing the pegheds was a
huge upgrade to an overall good oud.
Take care,
Mike
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
| Quote: Originally posted by Mike | Hey Robert,
Just picked up some of these for Maurice. Just curious...what size did you use? I got Mo one set (i.e. 3 sets of 4) of the 9.0mm, and a few of the 8.5
and 8.3. The 7.8 is the most common, but may be too small for an oud. These are really great pegs, and in my opinion well worth the...
Take care,
Mike |
Hi Mike, I used P1VN44 EH (7.8mm) throughout the whole oud and there was plenty of length to play with. I also ordered a set of 7.8mm for my Stenzel
oud which is 7 course Arabic type of oud (though with an exceptionally elegant and slim peg box. But the measurements show that the 7.8 will be enough
here too.
There is a link on their home page to the actual measurements of the different sizes of the pegs (see here: perfection pegs sizes)
For me it looks like the only difference is in diameter (which would mean that it depends of how far the holes are reamed out in first place...
best wishes
Robert
|
|
|
Alfaraby
Oud Junkie
Posts: 796
Registered: 9-18-2009
Location: Holy Land
Member Is Offline
Mood: Cool
|
|
I have had these planetary geared smart pegs on my son's oud for the last year or so and he's so happy with them.
Actually I am  . I fitted them in his 1/2 oud, which previously had 7.8 rosewood
pegs, using 1:30 taper reamer.
Choosing the right taper is perhaps the second important thing that should be taken care of after choosing the right pegs.
Viola pegs are often chosen for ouds due to their longer and thicker shaft. Violin &/or Viola shafts taper is 1:30, while Cello taper is usually
1:25.
Taper may be easily calculated using this simplified equation: (a-b)รท c (a: diameter under ring, b:diameter at the edge. c: shaft length). Once you
have the exact reamer for these geared pegs, you are going to experience a whole new generation: no breakage, no slipping, no crashes minutes before
going on-stage, no more endless hours of tuning the last accurate cent you'd want.
IT'S OVER !
An eminent oud player once said after using these geared pegs: I've probably wasted 5 years of my life in tuning ouds ! What a waste. ENOUGH !
Regardless of this topic, last week I ordered more sets for my ouds, after closely observing those black dwarfs on action on my son's, for almost a
year.
I picked Wittner's Finetune Pegs for the old company's reputation and experience. Wittner does not sell just anything.
This does not belittle the others: Knilling's or Herin's. I assume they are as good and suitable.
Take A look: http://www.wittner-gmbh.de/cgi-bin/db_search_e.pl?rubrik=Finetune-P...
BTW, I have ordered the 9.2 mm at ring, since the regular wooden oud-pegs and peg-holes are pretty close to these dimensions and cone.
Waiting for the sets to arrive, I'm literally frightened I might fall in love with those new bastards on my favorite, so that I'd have to replace all
the others. OMG ! This is going to cost me a real fortune, believe me.
As to the expense, let us just remember how much we pay for perishable components such as the high quality strings that we usually throw away after a
month or two, or such as polishing and cleaning solutions; or for maintenance like adjusting the action or leveling the fingerboard. Compared to these
expenditures, this expense is once in a oud life-time, so let it be.
One last thing: I've decided to order only 10 pegs for each of my ouds (C shall stay in wood) not intending to save a nickel or two, but because the
Finetune pegs I've ordered weigh 4-5 grams or so more than any matching rosewood or ebony peg I have weighed. Take a look.
Good tuning
Yours indeed
Alfaraby
[file]31318[/file] [file]31320[/file] [file]31322[/file]
Ebony / Rosewood / Finetuner
alfarabymusic@gmail.com
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
I also considered Wittner, but they only have ABS knobs, andI did not want to habe plastic knobs on my oud. So I decided to go for the Perfection
Pegs. They also don't sell just anything 
|
|
|
Jody Stecher
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1353
Registered: 11-5-2011
Location: California
Member Is Offline
|
|
Is there a reason that "Pegheds" have not been mentioned (except once in passing)?
http://www.pegheds.com/index.htm
Has anyone tried these on oud?
|
|
|
Mike
Super Administrator
Posts: 1568
Registered: 12-3-2002
Location: California, USA
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy
|
|
Hey Robert,
Thanks for the info. Looks like you got lucky with the sizing being a perfect match. That's awesome.
Jody: I think John Herin's "Pegheds" are the same as the Knilling Perfection Pegs and the ones sold by the Australian company where Robert got his
from. I may be wrong about this, but I believe those may be his distributors. Lee put the Pegheds on his oud, but unfortunately I think the pictures
of that oud with them on it were deleted when I had to prune a bunch of attachments a few months back.
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Jody, From my little research I think Pegheads and Perfection Pegs are basically the same, though Pegheads are very sparsely documented as to their
properties; there is not even an installation document on the web.
And being happy with the Perfection Pegs I don't see any reason to search any further.
|
|
|
MatthewW
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1031
Registered: 11-5-2006
Location: right here
Member Is Offline
Mood: Al Salam
|
|
these geared tuners look like a great discovery, and if our man Alfaraby is excited about these new 'bastards' then so am I, knowing what an oud
fanatic he is!
Like many of us, I get soooooo frustrated at times by trying to fine tune my oud and twisting a peg this way or that. I recall a spoof clip on youtube
about some guy trying to tune his oud and the pegs creaking like mad, I think he finally pulled out some pliers to turn them - would love to see it
again, anyone have a link to ti?
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
All I can say is that after installing these geared pegs I asked myself why I have spent so much time struggling to tune my oud well ... it's a new
oud life.
|
|
|
Alfaraby
Oud Junkie
Posts: 796
Registered: 9-18-2009
Location: Holy Land
Member Is Offline
Mood: Cool
|
|
| Quote: Originally posted by MatthewW | | . I recall a spoof clip on youtube about some guy trying to tune his oud and the pegs creaking like mad, I think he finally pulled out some pliers to
turn them - would love to see it again, anyone have a link to ti? |
http://youtu.be/KwGqsWNc_MU
alfarabymusic@gmail.com
|
|
|
MatthewW
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1031
Registered: 11-5-2006
Location: right here
Member Is Offline
Mood: Al Salam
|
|
thanks Alfaraby, that clip about sums up the problem!
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
| Quote: Originally posted by Lute | | Expensive for what they are! I will wait until the Chinese start making them, perhaps they already have:-) |
Maybe expensive for somebody with too little money to buy them (which is a pitty but doesn't have anything to do with the pegs themselves), but
certainly not expensive for "what they are". They are little wonder machines.
Of course Chinese learn to imitate everything and maybe also, with time, to invent great things. After a while maybe everything will be 'Made in
China'. That will be the moment when the chinese products will cease to be cheaper than any others because they will be no other things.
Sometimes we have to reflect our attitudes and their consequences in the long run...
|
|
|
hussamd
Oud Junkie
Posts: 117
Registered: 12-18-2013
Location: Bartlett, IL
Member Is Offline
|
|
For people that live in the US, Musiciansfriend.com has them. They have 15% sale every now and then. That would be the time to get them.
|
|
|
rojaros
Oud Junkie
Posts: 580
Registered: 7-9-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
They are on sale on Musicianfriend.com right now, but only in the simple ABS plastic knob version (which might be OK as well)...
|
|
|
hussamd
Oud Junkie
Posts: 117
Registered: 12-18-2013
Location: Bartlett, IL
Member Is Offline
|
|
Finally decided to install the perfection pegs on my Ghadban oud. Any advice on string order since the string holes may not be conveniently located
like when drilling them to order on a wooden peg. I want to avoid drastic string angles from the nut to the peg. The pegs are here but the stupid
post office missed the delivery for the reamer.
I have had it with pegs slipping and 3 hand tuning exercise.
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xmbprobrown/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
