cedarmustache
Oud Admirer
Posts: 4
Registered: 4-26-2021
Member Is Offline
|
|
sound adjustments
hello to all forum members.
im currently working on (a turkish) oud.
the state i bought it in was mediocre sounding and build however all is fixed.
however not having much experience working with ouds in particular i have many questions remaining.
when i bought the oud the sound was lacking mids. i managed to thin the top plate without losing treble creating more mids and a little more bass. did
not overdo it ofcourse. especially where the grains were wider i sanded it a bit and where the grains were narrow i left it almost untouched in my
attempt to create a fuller spectrum of sound. i achieved that more or less it sounds lovely.
well other work ive done on it is thin the body a bit while taking off the thick polyurethane finish and replacing it with shellac ( from fresh
flakes, dewaxed ) also impregnated the body and top plate of the instrument with eggwhite and sanded it off after.
furthermore i replaced the maple nut with a bone nut, gave the pegs a deeper fit and removed excess, also reshaped them professionally. used filets on
some cracks and reglued here and there. planed the neck,, with a very slight angle backwards, lowered the bridge. reshaped the pegbox and inlayed
ornaments here and there as well. replaced a composite thick pickguard with a real wooden one however i made it paperthin and since it got dents while
playing had to coat it with shellac. also made an armrest from mahagony which doesnt interfear almost with the top plate.
i might have missed out on things i did to it..
so i was curious for small adjustments and how it would affect the sound.
for example tinkering with violins i see that the smallest adjustments can have drastic changes on the sound.
so i was wondering part from the top plate and the basics.
what else could i do to tweak the sound to be a bit more brilliant.
so i was thnking specifically about. polishing as much shellac off the instrument again once it fully cures.
finding the lightest pegs i can get my hands on ( currently rosewood )
taking the shellac coat off the bridge maybe? and sanding it less bulky?
the bridge is maple btw but as far as i know that should handle treble frequencies fine right? any better choice for the oud and my specific goals
with it?
also the strings im currently using are ej95
all in all the instrument lacked color especially on the nylon strings. more or less im shocked that it improved so much.
so all in all, im very curious to hear opinions and experience and hopefully learn more.
|
|
|
cedarmustache
Oud Admirer
Posts: 4
Registered: 4-26-2021
Member Is Offline
|
|
meanwhile i got it exactly to how i wanted it by taking some mass off the bridge. quite a drastic change. bass is fuller, but not boomy. it became
more clear and brilliant.
i wouldnt want to change the sound after it reached this point as the instrument also is new and needs to be played.
all in all it turned out having a very clear and brilliant sound with full range of bass mids and treble. very resonant and clear.
id still be interested in opinions or suggestions however.
here is a recording as i bought it prior to any adjustments, keep in mind the strings were a bit thicker diameter than ej95 probably older and
cheaper, and the playability was terrible. also in the recording prior i was forced to use one string course of metal strings instead of synthetic
because i missed the E set. it can be noticed cause they stick out a bit.
furthermore both recordings used the same phone, however the phone tends to make things a bit more nasal.
prior: https://www.dropbox.com/s/u14ykxi3i34hb3v/before.m4a?dl=0
after: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5fjm4tv2osvrgrp/after.mp3?dl=0
im considering taking just a bit more off the bridge, i saved that for last as to improve the rest first.
|
|
|
Kelly
Oud Junkie
Posts: 285
Registered: 1-30-2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Hi There and welcome to the forum.
Sounds like you’re really motoring with the refurbishment and the oud sounds a lot clearer and brighter.
I think you’re right to give the oud time to adjust through regular playing before doing anything further with the bridge, if at all. Even small
adjustments esp on the wings can make a big difference and you might have reached that fine balancing point. Have you noticed any major change to the
feel of the strings such loss of string tension or better response?
I don’t think any cosmetic changes to the bowl finish or pegs are going to influence the sound but just add to the comfort and feel of playing
Enjoy your oud odyssey !
Good luck and enjoy your oud odyssey
Kelly
|
|
|
cedarmustache
Oud Admirer
Posts: 4
Registered: 4-26-2021
Member Is Offline
|
|
i started improving it while being on the old strings and recently when i changed strings i did the finishing touches.
the daddario set strings are thinner and have less tension, more tone and better response. when i had just put them on they sounded very metallic,
which i personally love btw but after some days of playing the wound strings get duller.
the difference must be not because they are a certain brand but probably the thinner diameter and less string tension.
as you hear the sound was quite disappointing in the beginning. string action was also way too high
at the joints there was heaped polyurethane of 3 mm maybe even, so when i had taken the varnish off i just thought why not try to change everything on
it and see how far i can improve it as an experiment to learn more.
part from change in varnish i have also thinned out the bowl, not a lot but just a bit, after i made sure every bit of varnish that had penetrated was
removed i impregnated it with eggwhite because afaik it lessens penetration of varnishes into the wood, not that shellac would penetrate a whole lot
but still decided to give it all.
as the sound turned out lovely i thought to myself its worth keeping this oud so i decided to decorate it after with mother of pearl here and there.
just small details, its not loaded with it.
i never owned an oud before and always wanted one.
i think because turkish ouds are quite lightweight, changing one thing might not change much but if you add up all together and consider that
everything i did to it made it even more lightweight it might have added up to a different tone. btw the difference in volume is drastic. tastes in
sound is something subjective if the quality of the tone is good but im loving it how it turned out.
basically i know nothing about ouds yet, so i hope to learn a lot here.
i wanted to ask however, does anyone know if the neck on ouds should have a slight tilt backwards? i thought to myself this way the string has more
clearance to vibrate as its further from the top plate and part from that would be less likely to bend the neck forward in the future and also take
off some weight. i didnt overdo it though, just barely.
btw kelly you were completely right. today i tried sanding the bridge a bit more and the sound lost a bit of its quality as compared to last time. and
a bit of treble too.
it is really weird because up until that spot sanding the bridge added clarity and treble and beyond that spot the opposite.
however i added some support strips of maple on the inside of my pegbox. although the weight isnt much. my pegbox was a bit thinner than average and
didnt want to risk it being cracked because i had already fixed it before.
furthermore the only thing i did was very lightly wipe the top plate clean with steelwool. cannot be considered sanding since i just cleaned a few
spots off. and also polished the varnish a bit.
good thing is the bridge is currently unvarnished and unpainted. the weight i have taken off will be added back on and be right where it was.
i think i have peaked the potential with this oud. at least with my own capabilities as a hobbyist... 
|
|
|
suz_i_dil
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1061
Registered: 1-10-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
hello
nice experiments. Removing thick shellac, thick pickguard is always a good idea i think. I had also good results on sound imporvement once, asking a
friend to make a bridge more light on an oud which had a thick bridge plate. Can be tricky to work the shape of the bridge on the soundboard so I
asked a professionnal to made it.
Maybe you reached the limits for external issues. Then come the matter of the bracing, can worth working on it. But need some experience to evaluate
the flexibility of the soundboard to open some areas of vibration..but not too much  ( to weak may result in bad control of sound production and can make the soundboard subject to deformation ). I never did it myself, it is tricky
to work braces without opening the soundboard.
If you go in this take your time, try to compare with a good oud to see more or less to which degree you want to reach, and consider if it is
reversible if i don't like the effect of this modification ? I once saw flattening a brace and finally went back, patching it to keep it higher. It
is tricky but possible. Always interesting but can mean a lot of effort.
good luck
|
|
|
cedarmustache
Oud Admirer
Posts: 4
Registered: 4-26-2021
Member Is Offline
|
|
|
|
|
Greg
|
Thread Moved
5-16-2021 at 04:00 AM |
![[*]](images/xmbprobrown/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
