cdroms
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Looking For : Turkish-style Ud, $200-400
Hello - Ud newbie here - Does anyone have available something per the title? Happy to pay shipping from anywhere, but located in Philadelphia, PA.
Thanks!
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coolsciguy
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Hi cdroms,
Your budget is a little low for a good instrument, however here is one on FB marketplace for sale that looks good:
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1145933062745542/
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cdroms
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Quote: Originally posted by coolsciguy  | Hi cdroms,
Your budget is a little low for a good instrument, however here is one on FB marketplace for sale that looks good:
[url]https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1145933062745542/ |
[/url]
Thanks for the link, I did not even think to check facebook marketplace!
A couple of the online buying guides I saw suggested that, whereas the cheapo factory-made Arab ouds are unplayably bad, the equivalent Turkish uds
are reasonable for beginners. But I am inclined to trust the experience of people on this forum, and I guess you disagree with that assessment?
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coolsciguy
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I once purchased a Turkish oud in the $300 range and it was awful. It was intended to be my first oud and I would have given up had I not purchased
another oud. The second one I purchased was a Syrian made Zeryab oud for ~$550 and it was almost twice the price but way way better.
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cdroms
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| Quote: Originally posted by coolsciguy | I once purchased a Turkish oud in the $300 range and it was awful. It was intended to be my first oud and I would have given up had I not purchased
another oud. The second one I purchased was a Syrian made Zeryab oud for ~$550 and it was almost twice the price but way way better.
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Syrian made Zeryab as in, Arab style as opposed to Turkish? Why the switch? Is there a significant difference in how it feels to play each type (all I
know is the sonic differences, and that Turkish is a bit smaller)...
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coolsciguy
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| Quote: Originally posted by cdroms |
Syrian made Zeryab as in, Arab style as opposed to Turkish? Why the switch? Is there a significant difference in how it feels to play each type (all I
know is the sonic differences, and that Turkish is a bit smaller)... |
It was Turkish made but setup for Arabic tuning. Some of the best Arabic ouds are made in Turkey. What I was trying to imply is that a new oud with
$300 price tag from Turkey may look great but not recommended for ease of playing and sound.
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cdroms
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Other than price difference, what should/could I be noticing to differentiate the quality of the above $500 posting from this $375 https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1965110617156776/ or even this $260 oud https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/890810225440430/ ?
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coolsciguy
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It's hard to judge qualities just based on pictures and without a sound sample. Even with a sound sample it's tricky as some samples have sound
effects and some players know how to make any instrument sound good.
But here are a few specifications from these three ouds that make them separable based on price (judging by images):
$500 oud: note the beautiful sound bowl with alternating ribs and a thin strip between them. Also note the nice finish on the bowl. Ebony fingerboard
and tuners. Soundboard seems a higher quality one (uniform in color). The owner posted elsewhere that he paid $800 for this oud.
$375 oud: Same fingerboard and tuners as above, the soundboard looks a lesser quality from above (you can see the grain) and the finish on the bowl is
not as intricate as above
$260 oud: lesser quality fingerbord from the two options above and very basic bowl (unfinished).
This doesn't mean that any one would sound better than the other. Also important are the action height and no buzzing among other things. I have heard
some cheaper ouds have issues with scale - there are proportions that need to be set accurately and they may not be. It's hard to buy an oud online,
it's a hit or miss in most cases. If you buy from a reputable vendor, you may have the option to return if you don't like the instrument. Look up
Ethnic Musical or Sala music but focus on their better ouds not the cheaper ones.
Hope this helps
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Brian Prunka
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https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1145933062745542/
This oud looks fairly decent. As noted, can't necessarily tell a lot from pictures (for example fiingerboard looks ebony but could be a lesser wood
dyed black).
This one looks okay. The wide-grained soundboard is not inherently inferior (it can often even sound superior) but it is considered less desirable by
many and so it typically shows up on ouds that are more "budget." Which means that other (less visible) corners may be cut. The notable thing on
this oud is that the nut is wood, which will generally make tuning more difficult compared to bone/horn.
This oud has plastic pegs, definitely a marker of a cheap instrument. The fingerboard is an inferior wood. The nut looks like it might be bone but
given the other characteristics it might be plastic (generally even worse than wood as a material, though it depends on the kind of plastic). One
risk in an oud like this that is clearly made to be cheap, is that the wood was not cured properly and may split or have other issues in a short time.
The things that will matter the most as a beginner have to do with tuning and playability:
• Are the pegs a good wood (generally roosewood or ebony) and well-made, well-fitted
• Is the nut well-made and of a durable, hard material (generally bone or horn)
• Is the action playable and relatively consistent (low as possible at the nut, no more than 3mm at the neck joint, no dead notes or significant
buzzing).
| Quote: | | A couple of the online buying guides I saw suggested that, whereas the cheapo factory-made Arab ouds are unplayably bad, the equivalent Turkish uds
are reasonable for beginners. But I am inclined to trust the experience of people on this forum, and I guess you disagree with that assessment?
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This used to be more true, but the Zeryab factory has changed this landscape quite a bit. The Sukar factory always made good ouds. Egyptian
factories were hit and miss but have always produced penty of good ouds (it was just unpredictable if you couldn't play it first), the general quality
has gotten more reliable I've found. Still, there's an element of truth to this and if you are trying to buy a super-cheap instrument with no
experience, your odds are probably better with a Turkish-made oud than an Arab one. Turkey is producing many Arab-style ouds these days, though, so
it's not necessary to get a "Turkish" style oud even going this route.
I would generally regard around $500 as the minimum amount where someone in the US should plan on spending for a beginner/student oud. Of course, one
could get lucky, particularly with a used oud that someone gave up on.
I second coolsciguy in saying that Ethnic Musical and Sala Musik are pretty reliable retailers of new instruments, and their prices are decent.
These ouds from Sala are all in your price range and seem likely improvements over the ones listed, but above (though the first one seems
comparable).
https://salamuzik.com/collections/turkish-oud/products/turkish-mahog...
https://salamuzik.com/collections/turkish-oud/products/turkish-oud-a...
https://salamuzik.com/collections/turkish-oud/products/turkish-handm...
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cdroms
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| Quote: Originally posted by coolsciguy | It's hard to judge qualities just based on pictures and without a sound sample. Even with a sound sample it's tricky as some samples have sound
effects and some players know how to make any instrument sound good.
...
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Thank you both, this is all extremely helpful!
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cdroms
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If you happen to see this, do you remember where the owner (Vale Ann) posted elsewhere about this oud? Here is the facebook marketplace post for
reference: https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1297620880817322/?ref=sear...
I'm asking because I gave this guy a 'down payment' in advance of him flying into my city for unrelated reasons and bringing the instrument with him
for me to pick up, but as the date approaches I'm starting to think I might have been scammed.
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coolsciguy
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Keep your faith, cdroms. Here is the link to his other post:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/2418931004810417/permalink/595141949...
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cdroms
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OH!!! Thank you! This is great!
As for the person in that thread saying it looks like a lavta... lavta has frets, right? So it's just the angle of the first photo makes the neck look
a bit long, I guess...
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coolsciguy
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| Quote: Originally posted by cdroms |
OH!!! Thank you! This is great!
As for the person in that thread saying it looks like a lavta... lavta has frets, right? So it's just the angle of the first photo makes the neck look
a bit long, I guess... |
My pleasure! It's definitely an oud. Lavtas apparently come fretless as well but this is certainly an oud.
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Greg
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Thread Pruned
4-2-2023 at 09:48 PM |
cdroms
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Well, this Vale Ann character is definitely a scam artist. I'm not sure why you would use an oud of all things as the basis for
facebook-marketplace-based fraud, it doesn't seem like a high-traffic category. My guess is they did at one point actually have the pictured
instrument.
Anyway, it went like this: they're an 8-hour drive from me, so I (first mistake) suggested that I might pay for shipping instead of making the drive.
They said they happened to be flying into my city (Philadelphia) next month anyway, so if I was willing to wait, they would bring the oud with them
and save me money. But, since it was a month away and they had other interested buyers, I would have to send a deposit - half the total agreed-upon
cost, then I'd pay the rest once they flew over. OK, maybe this was a little fishy already. They had me use cashapp instead of venmo or paypal, which
I didn't realize at the time would make it much harder to claim fraud and get my money back (still working on this, fingers crossed). A few days
before their supposed flight they asked that I send the rest of the money beforehand, that they wouldn't bring the oud with them otherwise. I pointed
out that that wasn't what we had agreed, but that if they really wanted we could re-do the whole purchase on paypal with buyer protection. They
ignored both of these points and kept insisting. Now they're keeping my deposit supposedly because of the time they spent holding onto the instrument
instead of selling it to someone else. By now I have no doubt that they never had any intention of actually exchanging a real musical instrument for
money. Overall I think there were some warning signs early on and I was fairly naive, but I've also never experienced something like this.
All that is to say I'm still looking for / deciding on an oud, if anyone has anything they're interested in selling, or any leads not already
mentioned in this thread. And probably more in the $4-500 range based on what I now understand is reasonable pricing for a half-decent instrument.
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coolsciguy
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I am sorry to hear about your experience. This truly sucks. Let's report them on the FB marketplace so they can't redo what they did to you.
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Brian Prunka
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That's unfortunate. FB Marketplace seems like it doesn't have much in the way of buyer protection so it's ripe for dishonest actors to take
advantage.
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cdroms
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https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/576132791329443/
Well if any knowledgeable person happens to feel inclined to comment on this one... (and I should add this one's well within driving distance for
me...)
+ : bowl with alternating ribs and thin strips, the wood tuning pegs...
- : wood grain visible on the face (maybe a bad sign? maybe not), plus is the nut definitely wood? or could bone or horn look like that in a photo?
So I lean on 'probably not a very good instrument but may be worth driving out to see'? But they say they paid $650 for it, does it seem like they
basically overpaid based on the apparent quality of the instrument?
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coolsciguy
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| Quote: Originally posted by cdroms | https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/576132791329443/
Well if any knowledgeable person happens to feel inclined to comment on this one... (and I should add this one's well within driving distance for
me...)
+ : bowl with alternating ribs and thin strips, the wood tuning pegs...
- : wood grain visible on the face (maybe a bad sign? maybe not), plus is the nut definitely wood? or could bone or horn look like that in a photo?
So I lean on 'probably not a very good instrument but may be worth driving out to see'? But they say they paid $650 for it, does it seem like they
basically overpaid based on the apparent quality of the instrument? |
This looks like a fairly low quality oud, and doesn't look so Turkish either. For $650 one can get a fairly ok oud directly from Turkey (ethnic
musical, Sala, etc), or a solid syrian Zeryab oud. This one doesn't compare to either.
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cdroms
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| Quote: Originally posted by coolsciguy | | Quote: Originally posted by cdroms | https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/576132791329443/
Well if any knowledgeable person happens to feel inclined to comment on this one... (and I should add this one's well within driving distance for
me...)
+ : bowl with alternating ribs and thin strips, the wood tuning pegs...
- : wood grain visible on the face (maybe a bad sign? maybe not), plus is the nut definitely wood? or could bone or horn look like that in a photo?
So I lean on 'probably not a very good instrument but may be worth driving out to see'? But they say they paid $650 for it, does it seem like they
basically overpaid based on the apparent quality of the instrument? |
This looks like a fairly low quality oud, and doesn't look so Turkish either. For $650 one can get a fairly ok oud directly from Turkey (ethnic
musical, Sala, etc), or a solid syrian Zeryab oud. This one doesn't compare to either. |
OK, thanks for your assessment! Very helpful. I will probably end up going the Sala route, and regret not having done so in the first place...
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teslim
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just for your information , i have ordered the 399 ouds for students from sala , they are very good quality, nice pegs ,finish and sound and
playability, and shipping is free and sala backs everything they sell. i would highly recommend them
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Brian Prunka
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I agree with coolsciguy. This oud might be pretty decent, hard to tell, but doesn't inspire confidence. 650 doesn't seem wildly unreasonable to me,
but at that price you can probably get something better direct from Turkey.
If you were an accomplished player, I'd say it doesn't hurt to go check it out — maybe it's hidden gem! But as a beginner you probably won't really
be able to assess whether this oud is worth more than it appears.
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