MyStringsDoLie
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I hate my Do!!
Hi All - I currently have an arabic oud which came with Kurschner strings Do Do. I like all the strings, except for the nylon Do. I wish it was a tad
deeper. Every time I hit it, it sounds too high pitched even though it is in tune. I learned that some brands may allow you to select custom sizes for
each string? some people also recommended mixing and matching strings. Any recommendations?
Thank you!
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Brian Prunka
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Kurschner are usually PVF, which is thinner than nylon or nylgut. It's also fairly bright-sounding.
Nylon would be thicker for similar tension and is slightly darker.
Nylgut is in between in thickess and has a sound that is somewhat dark but not dull.
PVF is usually .54 or even .52 for Do.
Nylon is .650 to .700 mm
Nylgut is .58 to .60 mm
I use Nylgut lute strings from Aquila on my 60cm ouds, .58mm.
If you have a shorter oud (58-59cm), use the thicker end of the ranges (.675-.700mm for nylon, .60mm for nylgut).
If you change the Do, you might want to change Sol as well to match.
Nylon is usually .725 to .800mm
Nylgut is usually .70 to .76mm
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coolsciguy
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Hi Brian,
Where can one buy individual Nylgut strings?
Thanks
-- Amir
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Brian Prunka
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Mustafa had them at oudstrings.com:
https://oudstrings.com/collections/plain/products/aquila-lute-0-58-m...
The "oud" strings are similar, a bit cheaper (I prefer the "lute" version but these are a good option too).
https://oudstrings.com/collections/plain/products/aquila-71o-arabic-...
He seems to be out of the .70-.76 range for the g course.
A bit pricier here:
https://www.aquilausa.com/product-page/new-nylgut-string
You may be able to order direct from Aquila as well.
I stocked up a while back from Mustafa, so I'm set for a while! They last me about a year usually.
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MyStringsDoLie
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Thank you so much Brian! I think I get what you are saying and I will start searching for some new strings. This is very helpful!
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MyStringsDoLie
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I have a follow up question, sorry I am new to this.
To be clear, say I have a 60cm Arabic oud and I want to try Nylgut, you recommend .58 for Do and .70 for Sol? I can always go up as long as I match
the two?
I can't wait to change them and practice my Longa Farahfaza because right now the transitions on the Do are just way too rough. I am sure it is also
my technique - I am a very new student of the instrument.
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Brian Prunka
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Quote: Originally posted by MyStringsDoLie  | I have a follow up question, sorry I am new to this.
To be clear, say I have a 60cm Arabic oud and I want to try Nylgut, you recommend .58 for Do and .70 for Sol? I can always go up as long as I match
the two?
I can't wait to change them and practice my Longa Farahfaza because right now the transitions on the Do are just way too rough. I am sure it is also
my technique - I am a very new student of the instrument. |
More or less, though different ouds will respond differently in different ranges. One thing I didn't mention is tat floating bridge ouds often do
better with heavier strings, so you might go higher if you have a floating bridge (even up to .62/.79 if it's short).
Personally, I tend to feel the .58 and .73 match well. Some ouds do better with a little lighter Sol (.70). So .58 and .70 might be good, or on a
shorter oud (or floating bridge) .60 and .76 might be best.
Every oud is a bit different so there's always some experimentation involved to find what works ideally for you.
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MyStringsDoLie
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Thank you so much! I have a Nahat (Shami) oud from Ziryab and my bridge is not a floating one. I will check the measurements again today.
I understand what you are saying about the need to try different strings, and I thank you for helping me start my investigative process.
I just noticed - actually Brian, I almost moved to NY this year and I am confident that I came across your work when I was looking for cultural
outlets and oud players in the city. As a matter of fact, I know that some of my favorite local artists from Chicago and MI worked with you before on
previous events. I am not a musician and I am only recently trying to learn oud (instrument and theory). I look forward to familiarize myself more
with your work.
All the best!!
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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| Quote: Originally posted by MyStringsDoLie | Thank you so much! I have a Nahat (Shami) oud from Ziryab and my bridge is not a floating one. I will check the measurements again today.
I understand what you are saying about the need to try different strings, and I thank you for helping me start my investigative process.
I just noticed - actually Brian, I almost moved to NY this year and I am confident that I came across your work when I was looking for cultural
outlets and oud players in the city. As a matter of fact, I know that some of my favorite local artists from Chicago and MI worked with you before on
previous events. I am not a musician and I am only recently trying to learn oud (instrument and theory). I look forward to familiarize myself more
with your work.
All the best!! |
Thanks - hopefully our paths will cross sooner or later 
I was supposed to play with Karim when he was here in the fall but unfortunately I got Covid and had to cancel.
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MyStringsDoLie
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Love Karim. He is always on the go and I wish I knew the secret to his insane level of energy. Sorry you had Covid and hope you are well. I hope to
see you both work together soon.
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MyStringsDoLie
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| Quote: Originally posted by Brian Prunka | | Quote: Originally posted by MyStringsDoLie | I have a follow up question, sorry I am new to this.
To be clear, say I have a 60cm Arabic oud and I want to try Nylgut, you recommend .58 for Do and .70 for Sol? I can always go up as long as I match
the two?
I can't wait to change them and practice my Longa Farahfaza because right now the transitions on the Do are just way too rough. I am sure it is also
my technique - I am a very new student of the instrument. |
More or less, though different ouds will respond differently in different ranges. One thing I didn't mention is tat floating bridge ouds often do
better with heavier strings, so you might go higher if you have a floating bridge (even up to .62/.79 if it's short).
Personally, I tend to feel the .58 and .73 match well. Some ouds do better with a little lighter Sol (.70). So .58 and .70 might be good, or on a
shorter oud (or floating bridge) .60 and .76 might be best.
Every oud is a bit different so there's always some experimentation involved to find what works ideally for you.
|
Hi Brian, last follow up on this, sorry!
When I measure my Zeriab Nahat, I am going from nut to the hole in the bridge and I am getting 23 1/4 inches, so 59.05 cm. If I go to the middle of
the bridge, I get 23 3/8, which is 59.3 - so I am guessing I can call it a 59.37 cm oud.
I see you recommended the below set to someone, but when I checked oudstrings.com I couldn't find most of them. Assuming you agree with the measures
(I understand I may have to try different ones to see how my Oud will sound), are there other sellers that you use?
LaBella Lute 0.043 - can't find it
LaBella Lute 0.033 - can't find it
LaBella Lute 0.027
LaBella Lute 0.023
Aquila Lute Nylgut 0.076 (based on my oud size?) - not at Oudstrings, but at Aquila's
Aquila Lute Nylgut 0.060 (based on my oud size?) - not at Oudstrings, but at Aquila's
Thanks again for your time Brian!!
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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those sound about right, and where I would start. The wounds are what I use at 60cm, at ~59 cm, you may end up wanting some of those slightly heavier
but it's hard to predict. I use .58 and .73 for the nylgut but at 59cm I expect that 60cm and 76 will be a little more present.
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coolsciguy
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| Quote: Originally posted by Brian Prunka | | those sound about right, and where I would start. The wounds are what I use at 60cm, at ~59 cm, you may end up wanting some of those slightly heavier
but it's hard to predict. I use .58 and .73 for the nylgut but at 59cm I expect that 60cm and 76 will be a little more present.
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Hi Brian,
Correct me if my understanding is wrong, but wont we need slightly lighter strings for shorter scale ouds given same tension and tuning?
-- Amir
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MyStringsDoLie
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Any idea where else I can shop for the strings that I can't find ?
Thank you!!!
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2916
Registered: 1-30-2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Mood: Stringish
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| Quote: Originally posted by coolsciguy | | Quote: Originally posted by Brian Prunka | | those sound about right, and where I would start. The wounds are what I use at 60cm, at ~59 cm, you may end up wanting some of those slightly heavier
but it's hard to predict. I use .58 and .73 for the nylgut but at 59cm I expect that 60cm and 76 will be a little more present.
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Hi Brian,
Correct me if my understanding is wrong, but wont we need slightly lighter strings for shorter scale ouds given same tension and tuning?
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It's exactly the opposite.
We can think of Tension = length x mass x pitch
This is greatly oversimplified, and doesn't actually work for calculations - the actual math can be reviewed here: https://davidvanooijen.wordpress.com/calculating-string-tensions/
But for this question we can use a simplified understanding.
For tension to remain the same, if length is reduced either mass or pitch have to be increased.
Assuming we are keeping tension and pitch the same, the mass of the string must be increased—i.e., a heavier string if the scale is shorter.
So all else equal:
Heavier strings produce more tension, lighter strings have less tension (pitch, scale length remain the same)
Longer scale lengths have more tension, shorter scale lengths have less tension (pitch and string mass remain the same)
High pitch has more tension, low pitch has less tension (length and mass remain the same)
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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Location: Brooklyn, NY
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You can buy directly from Aquila and Labella I believe. I haven't checked recently but sometimes Strings by mail has good options. If you are not in
the US I'm not sure what the best options are.
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coolsciguy
Oud Junkie
Posts: 225
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Location: Washington D.C.
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| Quote: Originally posted by Brian Prunka |
It's exactly the opposite.
We can think of Tension = length x mass x pitch
This is greatly oversimplified, and doesn't actually work for calculations - the actual math can be reviewed here: https://davidvanooijen.wordpress.com/calculating-string-tensions/
But for this question we can use a simplified understanding.
For tension to remain the same, if length is reduced either mass or pitch have to be increased.
Assuming we are keeping tension and pitch the same, the mass of the string must be increased—i.e., a heavier string if the scale is shorter.
So all else equal:
Heavier strings produce more tension, lighter strings have less tension (pitch, scale length remain the same)
Longer scale lengths have more tension, shorter scale lengths have less tension (pitch and string mass remain the same)
High pitch has more tension, low pitch has less tension (length and mass remain the same)
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Complete answer as always! Thanks Brian!
-- Amir
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