avicenna
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Registered: 12-22-2005
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broken oud neck
I recently purchased a used oud from a private individual. Although the oud seemed to be in reasonable condition when it arrived, the neck suddenly
snapped while I tried tuning it for the first time. From the break, it appears that the join between the pegbox and the neck had begun to come apart
(see the attached pictures).
Although the oud itself is not a professional instrument (the inlays and shamsiya are rather crude), I did pay enough money for it that I would like
to have it repaired. Moreover, the bowl (which appears to be made of walnut and paduak) is in good condition. Being that the break is not very clean
and has gone through the fingerboard inlays, I'm not entirely confident of my ability to fix it (I have taken a look at some of the related threads on
the forum). Do you folks have any suggestions? Let me know if I should post some more photos.
avicenna
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SamirCanada
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Ouch...! that looks like it hurt.
Well to tell you I have instrument made by the same maker Elie Yammine ( by the way he is not the real maker of the oud its a compagnie named Anwar
Kubeh and bros that make them in syria and then he adds a few details to call it his own since he can no longer make ouds since he's rather old)
Technicaly it doesnt look really fixable without making a new neck and replacing the fingerboard. you could keep the old peg box since it doesnt look
like it was harmed. The glue joint failed in your case its is the actual wood that snaped from the strings pulling the pegbox forward. Unfortunetly
the stings included in the posting on ebay site were guitar strings wich is probably (if you used those strings) why the neck snaped the tension is
too high for oud. Iam actualy suprised the brige did not snap.
The other thing I noticed from looking at the ebay post was that the shipping wasnt really expensive concidering what I usualy pay to ship ouds. Was
the packing good enough? Was the shippement "insured" you might be able to claim something.
I think its worth repairing only if you could do it yourself is another question but since you paid a conciderable amount for it you should have it
repaired by a luthier. There are a few verry trustworthy on this site that Iam shure will try to help you.
Regards.
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avicenna
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| Quote: | Originally posted by SamirCanada
(snip)
Technicaly it doesnt look really fixable without making a new neck and replacing the fingerboard. you could keep the old peg box since it doesnt look
like it was harmed. The glue joint failed in your case its is the actual wood that snaped from the strings pulling the pegbox forward. Unfortunetly
the stings included in the posting on ebay site were guitar strings wich is probably (if you used those strings) why the neck snaped the tension is
too high for oud. Iam actualy suprised the brige did not snap.
The other thing I noticed from looking at the ebay post was that the shipping wasnt really expensive concidering what I usualy pay to ship ouds. Was
the packing good enough? Was the shippement "insured" you might be able to claim something.
I think its worth repairing only if you could do it yourself is another question but since you paid a conciderable amount for it you should have it
repaired by a luthier. There are a few verry trustworthy on this site that Iam shure will try to help you.
Regards. |
Hi, Samir.
The packing could have been better; however, it seemed sufficient to prevent the oud from jostling against the sides of the box. The auction seemed to
indicate that the seller offered UPS as well as USPS shipping; however, when I checked out, only the latter was offered.
The seller did charge me insurance; being that the oud was not visibly damaged in shipping and only self-destructed afterwards, I'm don't know that I
could make a strong case for a claim.
A more theoretical question for any oud makers out there: is the pegbox of an oud always affixed to the neck in the fashion I observed? It seeems that
it would be preferable (albeit more costly) to carve the pegbox and neck out of a single piece of wood (e.g., like a violin).
Note to other readers: any recommendations regarding luthiers in New York City would be highly appreciated.
Thanks,
avicenna
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palestine48
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i only know najib shaheen. his website is oudman.com i think. I think I would file a complaint to get a refund. Thats just my opinion.
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SamirCanada
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The pegbox is rather fragile in itself you could have the best protected sides but a little pressure on the head of the pegbox and you could have a
disasster.
I were you I would contact najeeb shaheen like Ramy has just mentioned to you. He's used to making such repairs and he is a excellent oud player so he
understands what is needed for good playability.
Unfortunetly if you went ahead and installed the guitar strings that came with it.. then its probably what contributed to breaking the oud. They are
not made for a oud and shouldnt be put on one. Well its partly his fault for saying it was fine to use on it, But your the one that actualy put them
on right? or were they allready on the oud? Because another major factor in this could have been that it was shipped with the strings under tension.
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Elie Riachi
Oud Junkie
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I do not think the guitar strings would be a problem (if I recall, guitar strings will be lower tension anyway.) I think the joint is just weak. If
I were you, I would carefully scrape the joint clean of glue with a razor and sand lightly. Avoid the jagged parts of the inlay. Now apply super gel
to the joint following the instructions on the gel's box. Make sure to also glue down the inlays (like a jigsaw puzzle.) Clamp it down good. Let it
cure for the maximum recommended time (I would at least let it cure for 24 hours) before stringing. Before stringing, check the fingerboard for
raised spots in the repaired area and sand down or scrape with a utility razor (make sure that you scrape in the direction of the splinter.)
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avicenna
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| Quote: | Originally posted by SamirCanada
The pegbox is rather fragile in itself you could have the best protected sides but a little pressure on the head of the pegbox and you could have a
disasster.
I were you I would contact najeeb shaheen like Ramy has just mentioned to you. He's used to making such repairs and he is a excellent oud player so he
understands what is needed for good playability.
Unfortunetly if you went ahead and installed the guitar strings that came with it.. then its probably what contributed to breaking the oud. They are
not made for a oud and shouldnt be put on one. Well its partly his fault for saying it was fine to use on it, But your the one that actualy put them
on right? or were they allready on the oud? Because another major factor in this could have been that it was shipped with the strings under tension.
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The oud was shipped with strings already attached which appeared to be guitar strings. After unpacking it, I plucked it once or twice and put it down.
It broke the second time I picked it up and tried fiddling around with the pegs.
avicenna
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avicenna
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| Quote: | Originally posted by palestine48
i only know najib shaheen. his website is oudman.com i think. I think I would file a complaint to get a refund. Thats just my opinion.
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I actually did inquire about a refund prior to the breakage because of my displeasure regarding certain aspects of the oud (which I actually asked the
seller about prior to purchasing it), but received no response. I'll try complaining a bit more, but somehow suspect that my limited time and energy
would be better spent on a consultation with the OudMan.
Thanks,
avicenna
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palestine48
Oud Junkie
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I remember ebay or paypal offering insurance for an extra fee to prottect a person from false advertising. I am not sure how effective that would be
in this case. But for future reference I think it would be wise to use the services of one of the advertised escrow agents when purchasing a product
of this value. how that works if I am not mistaken is the escrow company holds your payment until you approve the condition of the product.
but maybe your right, just fix it and go from there.
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Hank Levin
Oud Maniac
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Location: Medford, Oregon
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Something that definately contributed to the break was that the joint (already a delicate part of any oud's construction) that depends on the
integrity and strength of the slim tongue of wood that the head is glued to, after the neck has been notched for the head, has been further degraded
by all the inlay on the fingerboard layer. So, instead of helping to support the head, in combination with the basic wood of the neck, the fingerboard
up there is just a bunch of tiny decorative pieces with no strength whatever, leaving a piece of neck the size of a tongue depressor to support the
head. Neck needs to be "jacked up and a new one put under it." Unfortunately, installing a new neck is one of the trickiest parts of oud-making or
repair. To save from building and installing a whole new neck, you might be able to remove the fingerboard, leaving the stump of the neck, cut the
neck at a shallow angle and splice a hunk of mahogany on it, carve out a new end for the neck, replace the fingerboard, notch the new end of the neck
for the head, reglue the head (meanwhile keeping everything aligned perfectly, otherwise the strings won't stay over the neck), finish it all. That's
assuming the action was correct in the first place. Mm-m-m… Big job. Good luck. --Hank
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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Najib recently repaired a neck with a similar break in it (shipping damage, alas). It was a lot of work, but it was a very good oud, made (i think)
in the 1940s, so it was worthwhile.
Hank sure is right about it being a lot of work. You should have Najib look at it, but he'll probably tell you it's not worth it to fix.
You can call the number on his website, or try him at his place in Brooklyn 718-387-8333.
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