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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
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MAP of OUDISTAN
Hi All....
I want to get started charting the map of OUDISTAN...
...here is a very very quick and rough first take.
Please offer me some advice as to improve upon this: perhaps various colours to make distinguishments of various sorts?
 )
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Reda Aouad
Oud Junkie
Posts: 553
Registered: 1-2-2009
Location: Lebanon
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Speaking of oudland.. have you ever visited Lebanon? Are you planning to? Why and why not?
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Owain-Hawk
Oud Junkie
Posts: 205
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Location: Morecambe, UK
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Mood: Happy!
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Hi Edward, cool map. By the way, I have seen videos of Oud players in Senegal on youtube (can't find it now, saw it over a year ago). I don't think
its a tradition however..
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Reda Aouad
Speaking of oudland.. have you ever visited Lebanon? Are you planning to? Why and why not? |
Tempted... why do you ask?
Mohammed Antar encouraged me to go there - he says they still teach maqam "properly" there. Of course his brother is there. Also he set up for me an
invitation to go study oud making there with Albert Mansour.
However, I am still not sure where my next trip will take me... perhaps to Iran - - - ?
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Owain-Hawk
Hi Edward, cool map. By the way, I have seen videos of Oud players in Senegal on youtube (can't find it now, saw it over a year ago). I don't think
its a tradition however.. |
I wonder how much oud there is in West Africa??
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fhydan
Oud Maniac
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Registered: 3-13-2009
Location: Michigan
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Mauritania is an Arab country. So I assume oud is played there?
Also, the color green seems to have leaked onto the gulf between the arabian peninsula and iran.
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maran
Oud Junkie
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interesting how none of the countries that make up "oudistan" actually end in -stan, but the ones that do are outside of it. i thought that the
-stan root is part of indo-european morphology, which is why it doesn't appear in the semitic-speaking world . maybe should be something else,
"oud-ia"?
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Reda Aouad
Oud Junkie
Posts: 553
Registered: 1-2-2009
Location: Lebanon
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Edward Powell
Tempted... why do you ask?
Mohammed Antar encouraged me to go there - he says they still teach maqam "properly" there. Of course his brother is there. Also he set up for me an
invitation to go study oud making there with Albert Mansour.
However, I am still not sure where my next trip will take me... perhaps to Iran - - - ? |
Because Im Lebanese
(Location Qatar because Im currently working there..)
I don't know how much you know about Albert Mansour.. but he is one of the finest oud makers in Lebanon.. Marcel Khalife mostly plays his ouds. I once
watched a youtube movie about him but cannot find it at the moment.
I don't want to lengthen the discussion much and get off the topic here.. if you want we can discuss it elsewhere.. but I assure you there are very
fine makers aside Albert such as Fadi Matta and Nazih Ghadban.. and maybe you could also setup meetings with professional oud players who knows.. plus
it's one of the most beautiful Arab countries
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Reda Aouad
Oud Junkie
Posts: 553
Registered: 1-2-2009
Location: Lebanon
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Mood: No Mood
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fhydan
Mauritania is an Arab country. So I assume oud is played there?
Also, the color green seems to have leaked onto the gulf between the arabian peninsula and iran. |
The green is also not filling east Iran :P
About Mauritania.. personally I didn't hear of any oud players there..
But I have a Pakistani friend here who told me once that they also play it in Pakistan when I was playing my oud in front of him.. but not sure if it
is of tradition and heritage or not.. and what about its neighbor Afghanistan?
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Reda Aouad
Oud Junkie
Posts: 553
Registered: 1-2-2009
Location: Lebanon
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Edward Powell
Hi All....
I want to get started charting the map of OUDISTAN...
...here is a very very quick and rough first take.
Please offer me some advice as to improve upon this: perhaps various colours to make distinguishments of various sorts?
|
Well.. about the color issue.. we can distinguish the following from a first look:
- Turkey (origin for many maqams) and Greece (but how much are they related ?)
- The Arab Gulf (because of their distinctive rhythms and style of playing
- Iran (origin for many maqams)
- Iraq (distinctive style of playing - also origin of few maqams)
- Egypt (source of the greatest compositions ever)
- The Maghreb (Morocco / Algeria / Tunisia / Lybia)
- Soudan
Im not sure where we can classify other countries such as Lebanon, Syria and Palestine.. maybe with the Egyptian classification.. and what about
Yemen? I don't know much about it but can it be grouped with the Arab Gulf?
Maybe someone can also improve on my draft classification..
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Butrous
Oud Maniac
Posts: 60
Registered: 12-23-2006
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There is maqamat and an art music compound form like a nouba or waslah in Mauritania sung by women singers. I don't know if they use the oud.
You can find the oud in the East African coastal region all the way down to Zanzibar, where musicians might still use the oud in a style known as
Taraab, Taarab or Tarab.
There are Somali singing oud players.
Also, shouldn't you include Armenia?
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tchandler
Oud Maniac
Posts: 63
Registered: 1-10-2006
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hmmm, I don't see California on there...
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
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You can paint Azerbaijan and Armenia green too. They sometimes use the oud in their ensembles.
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DaveH
Oud Junkie
Posts: 526
Registered: 12-23-2005
Location: Birmingham, UK
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Yep, ouds right down the swahili coast (there's even an iraqi maqam called swehli, which I assume is related? - EDIT or maybe it's just to do with
the coast). I've seen one being played in Ilha de Mocambique.
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: g'oud
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| Quote: | Originally posted by fhydan
Mauritania is an Arab country. So I assume oud is played there?
Also, the color green seems to have leaked onto the gulf between the arabian peninsula and iran. |
...thanks, i'll clean up that green (glad it wasn't an oil spill:mad
youtube search turned up nothing for mauritania oud...
but this... cool music! is it oud?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8lVYH53odY
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: g'oud
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| Quote: | Originally posted by maran
interesting how none of the countries that make up "oudistan" actually end in -stan, but the ones that do are outside of it. i thought that the
-stan root is part of indo-european morphology, which is why it doesn't appear in the semitic-speaking world . maybe should be something else,
"oud-ia"? |
or... "oudland" 
..."oud republic?"
..."oud union?"
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: g'oud
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Reda Aouad
| Quote: | Originally posted by fhydan
Mauritania is an Arab country. So I assume oud is played there?
Also, the color green seems to have leaked onto the gulf between the arabian peninsula and iran. |
The green is also not filling east Iran :P
About Mauritania.. personally I didn't hear of any oud players there..
But I have a Pakistani friend here who told me once that they also play it in Pakistan when I was playing my oud in front of him.. but not sure if it
is of tradition and heritage or not.. and what about its neighbor Afghanistan? |
I think that there is not much happening musically (makam/oud musically) in the East part of Iran. I think the music we are "concerned" with is
focused in the west of Iran... and understanding THIS has help me to finally answer a long standing question I have had as to why suddenly when you
get to Afghanistan and Pakistan - all the microtones disappear. I see now that east iran is a sort of no-mans-land acting like a buffer-zone btw it
and those more "indianized" states to the east. [sorry for these gross over-generalizations].
I'm 99% sure there is not much oud presence in Afghanistan and Pakistan (they have RABAB). Also, at the moment there is basically almost no oud in
Iran (tiny bit of barbat and that's about it I am presuming) -- they have tar and setar.
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Owain-Hawk
Oud Junkie
Posts: 205
Registered: 6-17-2008
Location: Morecambe, UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: Happy!
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Edward Powell
| Quote: | Originally posted by fhydan
Mauritania is an Arab country. So I assume oud is played there?
Also, the color green seems to have leaked onto the gulf between the arabian peninsula and iran. |
...thanks, i'll clean up that green (glad it wasn't an oil spill:mad
youtube search turned up nothing for mauritania oud...
but this... cool music! is it oud?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8lVYH53odY |
I think they play either this, http://www.jeanduperrex.ch/Site/Corde_files/Gembri-horiz-filtered.j... or this http://www.oliverrajamani.com/images/brad.jpg in Mauritania...
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: g'oud
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Reda AouadWell.. about the color issue.. we can distinguish the following from a first look:
- Turkey (origin for many maqams) and Greece (but how much are they related ?)
- The Arab Gulf (because of their distinctive rhythms and style of playing
- Iran (origin for many maqams)
- Iraq (distinctive style of playing - also origin of few maqams)
- Egypt (source of the greatest compositions ever)
- The Maghreb (Morocco / Algeria / Tunisia / Lybia)
- Soudan
Im not sure where we can classify other countries such as Lebanon, Syria and Palestine.. maybe with the Egyptian classification.. and what about
Yemen? I don't know much about it but can it be grouped with the Arab Gulf?
Maybe someone can also improve on my draft classification.. |
So, perhaps Oudistan ought to be a sort of loosely held together federation of allied states? Each with it's own colour?
In this case what should those "states" be?
-perhaps according to style:
1. Turkey/Greece/Armenia
2. Egypt/Levent
3. Iraq
4. Iran
5. Magreb
6. Saudi/Arab Gulf/Oman
7. Sudan
8. Yemen
...perhaps this Oud Federation can have strong "allies" in places like California and France that are obviously not true "oudland states" but
nevertheless host a significant appriciation and practice of the art?
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mahoor
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| Quote: | | Also, at the moment there is basically almost no oud in Iran (tiny bit of barbat and that's about it I am presuming) -- they have tar and setar.
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You shouldn't confuse folk music with classical music (art music). In the East, they play robabs, sarood (the bowed type) etc. Ostad Nariman, one of
the first people to become a dedicated oud player is from Mashhad, which is in Khorasan area to the East.
They play a lot of oud in Iran. It's present in almost all ensembles along side the robab (the Persian type) to fill in for the bass.
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: g'oud
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Butrous
There is maqamat and an art music compound form like a nouba or waslah in Mauritania sung by women singers. I don't know if they use the oud.
You can find the oud in the East African coastal region all the way down to Zanzibar, where musicians might still use the oud in a style known as
Taraab, Taarab or Tarab.
There are Somali singing oud players.
Also, shouldn't you include Armenia? |
So Eritrea, Ethiopia, Somalia, Kenya, Mauritania should be included???
Maybe these states could be considered OUDISTAN SATELITE STATES? ...they could have a more faded colour.... what you think?
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: g'oud
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Peyman
You can paint Azerbaijan and Armenia green too. They sometimes use the oud in their ensembles. |
Armenia for sure.... but Azer???? Is not oud MUCH MUCH more prominent in Armenia. I have been under the impression that there is basically no oud
in Azer..... or should it get SATELITE STATUS ) ?
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: g'oud
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DaveH
Yep, ouds right down the swahili coast (there's even an iraqi maqam called swehli, which I assume is related? - EDIT or maybe it's just to do with
the coast). I've seen one being played in Ilha de Mocambique. |
So which countries (concretely) should get full OUDISTAN FEDERATION STATUS, and which should get SATELITE STATUS?
what about some youtube documentation for those questionable states? Maybe there should be some criteria... like minimum of 3 youtube oud clips for a
country of very good professional playing to get full status?? ) )
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Reda Aouad
Oud Junkie
Posts: 553
Registered: 1-2-2009
Location: Lebanon
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Edward Powell
| Quote: | Originally posted by DaveH
Yep, ouds right down the swahili coast (there's even an iraqi maqam called swehli, which I assume is related? - EDIT or maybe it's just to do with
the coast). I've seen one being played in Ilha de Mocambique. |
So which countries (concretely) should get full OUDISTAN FEDERATION STATUS, and which should get SATELITE STATUS?
what about some youtube documentation for those questionable states? Maybe there should be some criteria... like minimum of 3 youtube oud clips for a
country of very good professional playing to get full status?? ) ) |
HAHA.. Are you serious? Who says youtube can be a reference?! If no oud videos appear by typing "oud Afghanistan" in the search box in youtube does
that conclude it?
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Edward Powell
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1212
Registered: 1-20-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: g'oud
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...yes!
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