I'd like to lower the action on an oud. If the strings are tied at the bridge with loops pulled up, I can get maybe a half millimeter lower at the
neck/body junction by tying them low, but not much more.
I have not tried this on a whole set, but another 1/2 mm or more is achievable by not tying a normal loop, instead just making a knot at the end of
the string, maybe around a little bead if the hole is big, and simply threading through the hole in the bridge.
I have had to do this on short bass strings where there's not enough string to do a proper loop, and it quite lowers the action (where I don't WANT it
to). So how about threading all the strings that way? It might affect the timbre, compared to having the normal loops. But is it major? Please advise,
Old Timers: Is there a reason to not do this? Aymara - 12-10-2009 at 10:47 AM
Interesting question, but I wonder, if it might cause buzzing AND how to do it on the not wounded nylons ... I bet a simple knot won't work here?fernandraynaud - 12-10-2009 at 01:58 PM
It works on any string. If the hole is large relative to the string diameter, you tie the knot around a little bead or brass ring like they put on
steel guitar strings. I think that on the average oud it can lower the action by about 1.5mm at the bridge, or almost 1 mm at the kneck/body joint! So
this is not insignificant if it doesn't break some essential principle or tabu.Aymara - 12-10-2009 at 02:27 PM
I think that on the average oud it can lower the action by about 1.5mm at the bridge, ...
On my oud it would be maybe half a milimeter, not more.Luttgutt - 12-10-2009 at 02:36 PM
Hi fernandraynaud!
This is how I do it on all my floating brigde ouds. And lately I tried it on a fixed oud (Sukar oud and it works just fine. Did not notice any problem!fernandraynaud - 12-11-2009 at 05:37 PM
Thanks! Of course a floating bridge is not going to be affected.
On a fixed bridge, I would expect a slight effect on timbre, as the connection to the bridge is going to be different.
When the strings are tied with a loop the vibration of the string is passed to the bridge through a complicated suspension array. If you thread the
string through the bridge, it's a more straightforward connection. I would expect the timbre to be affected.
People have undoubtedly tried all different ways to tie down strings, and an experienced oud-maker would know all the consequences of different ways.
That was my question, is it noticeable, does it create any problems? Glad to hear it's OK on your Sukar.
So ... if nobody thinks it's a no-no, I guess I'll try it on a whole set.
Sazi - 12-11-2009 at 06:23 PM
I think it depends on the size and angle of the holes through the bridge, because if the hole is at an angle the string touches firmly enough at the
bridge face, however if the hole is relatively straight through you could get, as you suspected, a buzz or sound similar to that given by a tampura
bridge, where the string is vibrating very slightly against the edge of the hole.
I know because it happened that way for me. Perhaps if you did it to all the strings they would all have the same tone, but when i did it with just
one pair the difference was quite noticeable. (and totally un-usable)
Hope you have better luck.mrkmni - 12-12-2009 at 03:58 PM
Hi Fernand,
If the Oud bends even 1 mm ( deflection ), that means that it is not well done.
the neck part has to enter inside the soundboard...this is the difference of the Oud.
We have specialists here...
The deflection is calculated this way: Def. = 3 P L / E I
P is the force
L is the length of the element.
I is the moment of inertia
E is the elasticity modulus ====> is the most important and it is a material parameter. David.B - 12-13-2009 at 04:20 AM
Hi Tony,
What you propose is interesting and I check out my bridge visually :
All the holes are not exactly lined and on the D strings there is about 1 millimeter of difference. The "traditional" way they are tied allowed to
adjust the alignment. I can understand it improves the sound, but won't the holes, in front the nut, get bigger and bigger until big buzzes appear ?
But that's an interesting experience, tell us if it works during a long time without buzzes !
and it works just fine. Did not notice any problem!