Mike's Oud Forums

oud string length

geokal - 5-1-2014 at 07:15 PM

Hello to all!
First post here with a question to all oud experts.

I'm thinking to buy this oud but its with a floating bridge.

I'm new to oud world and searching all the time for information.
I want to ask what kind of strings(length) should i use for this oud and if this tuning is allright for this instrument.

Thank you all for this forum and all the information and sharing..:)

I don't have it in my hands yet to measure the scale but i believe in your critical eye!


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Greg - 5-2-2014 at 06:01 AM

Geokal, as this is a custom made instrument, I would suggest the best way to find out what tuning it was designed for would be from the maker: Christos Spourdalakis
http://www.music-instruments.gr/

geokal - 5-2-2014 at 03:41 PM

I have already contact with him to tell me that they tuning as turkish style all his oud.
He also told me that there was a problem with the top and he repair it.

Could high tension of strings caused the top to sink ?
Is this a turkish style oud?

Thank you for your answer.

Greg - 5-3-2014 at 08:37 PM

To answer your last question first; no, this is not the style of oud that would normally be identified as Turkish.
The floating-bridge oud design is more closely aligned with Iraq and with the Munir Bashir style. However, floating bridge ouds have become more popular in Arabic countries generally over the past few years. I know of no other Turkish ouds using that design, except for a recent release by the Turkish oud maker Faruk Türünz. But his new floating bridge oud is described as an Iraqi oud, not a Turkish oud.
I note the price of the Christos Spourdalakis oud is 1,500 Euros. For that sort of money you have a great choice of makers. There are a few excellent makers in Turkey who would make you a very good instrument for that price.
There are several listed on our FAQ pages. Here are three of them:
Faruk Türünz: http://www.oudmaster.com
Yildrim Palabuyik: http://www.turkishouds.com
Cengiz Sarikus: http://www.veyselmuzik.com

If you wish to purchase a Greek made instrument, take a look at these makers:
Dimitris Rapakousios: http://www.dimitrisouds.com
Jannis Alexandris: http://sites.google.com/site/alexandrisjannis/Home
Tasos Theodorakis: http://www.theodorakis.name/uk/frameset.html

I would urge you to do a search on these forums for each of these makers, to see what others think of their work.

Yes, high string tension can cause major problems to the structure of an oud, particularly to the top. If the oud in question was properly designed for Turkish tuning, then the damage may have been caused by the owner using strings of a higher tension than recommended. Generally speaking, you would never tune an oud designed for Arabic tuning to Turkish tuning, but it always comes down to the choice of string tensions. That could be done, provided the strings were carefully chosen to match the tension for which the intrument was designed.

I hope that helps.

Regards,

Greg

geokal - 5-4-2014 at 01:19 AM

Greg, thanks so much for your time and all the advices!

All the Greek makers you refer are well known, especially Rapakousios.
Spourdalakis is also a well known maker in Greek bouzouki and folk guitar.

I have no knowledge about this instruments but its clear that this oud is not Turkish style and shouldn't be tuned as this.
In a few days I'll have it in my hands so i can measure the scale
and put a suitable set of strings!

You help a lot with all your remarks as the last days serious confusions obsessed me.
Thanks so much.


Greg - 5-5-2014 at 01:07 AM

You're welcome Geokal.

Even though it does not look like most Turkish ouds, the maker has designed it for Turkish tuning, so that's what it is.
There is no physical reason why you couldn't tune it in the Arabic way (lower tension), but it may not sound as it should.
Most Turkish ouds have a scale length of 58.5 cm and most Arabic ouds have a scale length around 61 cm.
It will be interesting to see what the scale length of this instrument is. Please let us know.

Regards,

Greg

geokal - 5-10-2014 at 03:22 AM

ok, oud came at last and i measure the scale.
It's 58,5 cm from nut to bridge so it's Turkish.

Very loud instrument without a bit of buzz, low action and nice sound, but pegs needs some soap i think:shrug:

By the way can anyone understand what tuning this guy is using?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEP1dT1SOGE

Thanks so much!

Brian Prunka - 5-10-2014 at 04:57 AM

Many floating bridge ouds are made at 58 to 59 cm but are expected to use Arabic tuning (usually with high f'f'). I expect that this is partly because the floating bridge needs much longer strings; they don't want to make it more difficult by using a long scale to begin with.

Jody Stecher - 5-10-2014 at 05:33 AM

Quote: Originally posted by geokal  
ok, oud came at last and i measure the scale.
It's 58,5 cm from nut to bridge so it's Turkish.

Very loud instrument without a bit of buzz, low action and nice sound, but pegs needs some soap i think:shrug:

By the way can anyone understand what tuning this guy is using?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEP1dT1SOGE

Thanks so much!


The oud in the video seems to be tuned D GG AA dd gg cc. That is low to high.
I have played several Arabic ouds with a 58.5 scale and seen many more. Short scale is not enough to make an oud Turkish. For example at this very moment a forum member is selling an Arabic oud with a 58.5 scale. Have a look:
http://www.mikeouds.com/messageboard/viewthread.php?tid=14732

geokal - 5-10-2014 at 07:37 AM

I tune it down a whole step to D GG aa dd gg cc and i think the sound fits better.
Its like the instrument found its character. Still no buzz at all plus more flexible feeling.

What is the detail between Turkish and Arabic that makes the difference? Bowl? Top dimensions?
I still believe it's 80%Arabic 20% Turkish.

OMG i didn't expect that it would be so much difficult for me to understand...
I have read every post in this forum about floating bridge ouds.



Brian Prunka - 5-10-2014 at 01:07 PM

There is no one thing that makes the oud "Turkish" or "Arabic".

Turkish ouds generally seem to have slightly thinner tops and/or lighter bracing. Modern Turkish ouds are all 58.5cm (antique Turkish ouds are sometimes a bit bigger, but still under 60cm). Arabic ouds range from 58cm to 63cm.

Turkish ouds are all fixed-bridge ouds, while Arabic ouds come in fixed- and floating-bridge versions. The floating-bridge Arabic ouds are usually between 58cm and 59cm. Fixed-bridge Arabic ouds are usually between 60cm and 62cm, but can be shorter or longer.

The dimensions vary on the bowl depth and shape, and the width and length of the face.
There is a lot of variety in Arabic ouds (compare a Mohamed Fadel to Ibrahim Sukar for example). Turkish ouds are more uniform, but not entirely so.

Turkish and Arabic ouds tend to have different tonal characteristics (though no one agrees what they are), and prefer higher or lower tunings.

geokal - 5-10-2014 at 01:55 PM

How comprehensive you are Brian!!
You solve every question i have thought!!

Thank you all for your time and please forgive my ignorance..