torrevieja
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Registered: 7-10-2012
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Oud advice Ali Kalifeh
Hello, after reading so many topics, that's my first post in this forum.
I'm a newbe in the oud world. In fact I don't play oud. I play guitar since 15 years ago and now I'm so fascinated with the oud that I've decided to
buy one.
I don't need a first class oud but I don't want a souvenir. I've found an oud for sale near Spain (where I live), an Ali Kalifeh & Sons oud. I've
red in another topic that the quality of this ouds where quite good before Mr. Ali Kalifeh died, but now they are not as good as before.
Could anybody help me and give me an advice with this oud?
I'd also like to know if this is an arab style oud. I think I prefer lower piched, deeper sounding ouds.
Thanks and regards
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Giorgioud
Oud Junkie
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Hi Torrevieja,
and welcome to the forum. The information you've been given are quite correct. Khalife used to be one of the princes of the oud luthiers. Now it's
just an oud-making factory which churns ouds which are....well, no offence, but not what they used to be. If you have a quick research in the
second-hand buying and selling sites, the (modern) Khalife will always appear, sold at low prices from first-time owners who want to upgrade. It's a
shame, because the vintage Khalife, apart from being works of art, always fetch high prices, and rightly so.
Having said that, in the hands of the right person even a modern-day Khalife sounds beautiful. Check it out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFZ2enVnYW4&feature=player_embed...
It's an Arabic oud all right. Syrian, to be precise, Damascene. If you're looking for an Arabic sound you'll be happy with it. It's also a more than
decent oud for a first-time owner. The only thing is that you shouldn't pay too much for it. ArabInstruments.com sells it at the equivalent of 280
Euros. Even second-hand, prices range from 150 to 200-250 Euros (at least here in Britain) http://www.arabinstruments.com/112730/Syrian-Oud Even buying it from a shop which wants to make some money on it, paying more than 350 Euros quite
frankly is a bit of a theft. When you'll want to upgrade (and I am saying "when" because chances are that the oud will become a big, big part of your
life so you'll want a great-sounding instrument as soon as you can afford it) you'll have some problem recouping the money.
My advice is: buy it if it's not too expensive. I am saying this because for example, in Italy and in Britain (the places I have experience with) the
oud is such a niche market that sellers have no qualms at all buying really terrible ouds and selling them at absurd prices. This practice should be
discontinued. It's bad for the spreading of the popularity of the instrument.
For that deep sound that you like you should use a Standard Arabic tuning (from thinnest to lowest: cc, gg, DD, AA, FF, C), buying either a Standard
Arabic string set or a Turkish set which works wonderfully. http://www.oudstrings.com/ This retailer has the widest choice of sets you'll ever get, all prices and gauges and it takes only 6-7 days for
delivery in Europe (it's based in N.Y.).
Have lots of fun!!!
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ameer
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I almost had the opportunity to acquire what was said to be a vintage Ali Khalifa from 1975; unfortunately I never got to go take a look at it. He was
a Syrian luthier so his ouds are likely to have the typical dark bassy Syrian sound and sound better tuned down a wholestep or two. Modern Khalifas
are said to be nowhere near as good so if you can examine the instrument carefully before buying it; failing that, examine it before the return period
is up. Make sure everything is glued together securely and that the tuning holds reasonably well.
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spyros mesogeia
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I have an 1978 Ali Khalifeh Damascus Syria and it is a wonderful oud....bassy and loud,sustain and balanced sound....I really like it.
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ameer
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Is that the same one that was for sale in Brandywine Maryland about two years ago?
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spyros mesogeia
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no.that was restored by me....I also have put new horn rosettes
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Alfaraby
Oud Junkie
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Quote: Originally posted by Giorgioud  | | Khalife used to be one of the princes of the oud luthiers. Now it's just an oud-making factory which churns ouds which are ....well, no offence, but
not what they used to be ! |
Right ! The same applies on Jamil George's sons and Fathi Amin's son in Cairo & Mohamad Fadel's sons in Baghdad.
Even worse: Nahat great legacy in Damascus has totally vanished after George Hanna Nahat passed away back in 1965. None of Gohary, Laithy & Ahmad
Mohamad descendants in Cairo have ever get close to ouds. The same with Derbedrossian in Damascus; Hayek, Khawwam, Dallal, Abras & Others in
Aleppo; Amin Haddad in Haifa/Israel, Elias Jubran in Ramah/Israel. None of their kids have followed the steps of their father. What a great loss !
It seems that Luthiery is a death penalty or a life sentence of poverty, so why, for heaven's sake, would anyone want to stick with it !
Good oud ! Buy it for a couple of 100 EUR & string it with Pyramid 650 set : B b, F, C, G, E b, B b, a whole tone lower.
Arabic antique & vintage ouds are not supposed to be tuned as high as CGDAFC using regular strings. If ever, so only with low tension HQ strings
like Pyramid Lute !
Good luck ! You're going to need it 
Yours indeed
Alfaraby
alfarabymusic@gmail.com
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spyros mesogeia
Oud Junkie
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I do not Agree about the value of the ouds of Ali Khalife.My oud is a really sounding oud and it was made in 1978.I think that in the proper hands of
a luthier and if you put some work on it maybe you will be really lucky.I wouldn't sale mine now not even for two thousand dollars....all my students
love it.And personally I think that is one of the best ouds I ever played....
I can show it to you via skype if you want one day.
regards
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torrevieja
Oud Admirer
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Registered: 7-10-2012
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Wow! Thanks for all replies.
I wanted to know if the oud I posted was a vintage or new production one.
Let me take the advantage to ask for an apropiate oud for me. I mean, I want a good instrument (not a souvenir) but it doesn't have to be a first
class instrument.
By the way, don't you think that ouds are too expensive? I mean, I admire luthiers craftwork and mastery but their instruments cost as first class
concert and flamenco guitars built also by great luthiers but with much higher costs.
Thanks again for your advices.
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Giorgioud
Oud Junkie
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Well, yes, ouds are expensive, but that's not different from flamenco guitars like Alhambra, for example. Good instruments cost money.
The problem arises because in Europe the oud is not a mass-market thing, so if a retailer imports it, it wants to make sure to get a 200% mark-up on
the profit.
Hence the acquisition of the cheapest ouds which are then sold for the equivalent of 700 Euros or so. Too bad.....
Your oud, judging by the design, seems a modern one, probabily made in the mid-noughties. Inside the label there's the date it was made, written in
Arabic. Take a good, clear picture of it showing the writing and post it on the forum. There are a lot of Arabic-speaking folks who will be able to
help on that matter.
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spyros mesogeia
Oud Junkie
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I think that a really well made instrument could cost a little bit higher....
I also think that there are luthiers that take advantage of the buyers.But
there are also honest luhiers that they really respect the customers and their selves.
You just need to look the quality and not the ""brand""......
as I said,whatever you need and we can help let us know.this is a huge family with a common love.the oud.
regards to all
P.S.always see or hear the instrument.the last 10 years I have changed more than 100 ouds to find what I want.It is a matter of personal taste.
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
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Torre, welcome. Your photos are too small to see anything. If you can post some good close-ups we might be able to say more. This instrument could be
anything from useless to fixer-upper, to quite nice. And at least ask the seller to measure the height of the strings above the fingerboard at the
neck-body junction, the so-called "action".
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torrevieja
Oud Admirer
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Location: Spain
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Thanks for welcoming me.
I've edited the post and pasted bigger pictures, though I guess is a "new production" oud, so a lower quality instrument.
I wish I could hear and play many ouds before choosing, but I personally don't know anybody who plays oud. If you know someone in the north west Spain
who could introduce me I'd be very pleased. I guess that my first oud wont be the last, but I prefer to buy a mid, high-mid class instrument who can
be with me for some years.
And please, don't missunderstand me about the prices of ouds. I don't doubt about the honorability or profesionality of luthiers, I just got a bit
surprised because ouds made by luthiers cost as much as guitars made by luthiers who are setted in more expensive countries (salaries, rents, taxes,
etc). Of course I don't mean that ouds luthiers deserve less than anybody. Anyway, that was a quite stupid comment from a complete newbe.
Fernand, which would be a good action?
Thanks!
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Marcus
Oud Junkie
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Hi 
you have a U2U
Playing the oud is like feeding my soul with peace
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