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Dr. Oud
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What is it? contest
I am initiating a contest I'd like to call:
WHAT IS IT ?!?
Identify what the repair is for (or why) and win a genuine Dr. Oud autographed (in english and Arabic) nylon mizrab.
Professional oud makers are ineligible (you know who you are).
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Reda Aouad
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Although I know nothing about oud repairs, I will give it a shot.
If the rosette is hung this way it means that the face hasn't been pulled off of the body. So it must be something related to the bracings or maybe
adjusting the neck from the inside if it has some screw to do so. Or is it to glue a crack in the back from the inside?
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FastForward
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I think it is clear in the picture that the rosettes were removed to replace two broken pieces of the soundboard on the ring around the rosette. So
the rosettes were removed, two new pieces were glued in there. Other work can be done too on the inside, if there is a loose brace it can be fixed.
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Dr. Oud
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Quote: Originally posted by FastForward  | | I think it is clear in the picture that the rosettes were removed to replace two broken pieces of the soundboard on the ring around the rosette. So
the rosettes were removed, two new pieces were glued in there. Other work can be done too on the inside, if there is a loose brace it can be fixed.
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Good guess, and you are very observant that the ring around the rose was repaired, but alas, that's not what this picture is about, sorry. It is true
that some brace repair was done, so the rose was removed, but this repair is after that and has some other thing going on.
What is it?
BTW the rose does not necessarily need to be removed to repair the face edge.
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Dr. Oud
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| Quote: Originally posted by Reda Aouad | Although I know nothing about oud repairs, I will give it a shot.
If the rosette is hung this way it means that the face hasn't been pulled off of the body. So it must be something related to the bracings or maybe
adjusting the neck from the inside if it has some screw to do so. Or is it to glue a crack in the back from the inside? |
nope
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FastForward
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The other thing I can think of is fixing the bridge. You can also patch some holes/re-glue ribs in the back of the oud if they are not badly
damaged.
You can also take the rosette out, and fix it or make a new one. It seems that it has a slot so it can be easily removed. But I highly doubt that this
is the reason, cause the same old rosette is still there and removing the rosette would have been easier prior to reinstalling the broken pieces
around the rosette.
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bibo10
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I think you are just installing the rosette after building the oud...or adding rosettes to an old oud, maybe to avoid opening the face
+++++++++++
Michael-GOD BLESS EGYPT
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Reda Aouad
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Michael the rosette is a 100-year old. He can't be installing it. And the oud is old he can't be building it. And he can't install a rosette without
removing the face because he won't be able to get it inside (I guess).
Is the rosette broken and you glued it? (But in that case your contest would be too easy)
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bibo10
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yea i thought it would be too easy, but that might be the point 
and I think you can install the rosette after its built....lets hear it from the professor
+++++++++++
Michael-GOD BLESS EGYPT
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FastForward
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No Reda, the rosette can be easily inserted after gluing the face. Check the picture, it has a slot so what you do is you insert the soundboard into
the slot, turn the rosette into the oud, and then take the soundboard out of the slot.
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paulO
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Okay, I got it -- you want to keep the rose with the oud it goes with, not lose it, misplace it or otherwise, just not ready to glue it in yet...so
why not hang it where it won't go anywhere ?? 
Cheers...Paul
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Reda Aouad
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Good to know! Thanks FastForward.
But if it can be easily inserted and removed, why is it hanging like this? I mean why isn't it just removed aside while work is performed?
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bibo10
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the rosette looks cracked at one point, so maybe thats why its just hanging while it gets fixed
+++++++++++
Michael-GOD BLESS EGYPT
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Ararat66
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Here's my assesment 
Work needed to be done on a loose/cracked brace and the rosette was removed to gain access to the inside of the bowl. Unfortunately the rosette being
old came apart in the process. So once the work was done inside the oud the broken parts of the rosette were reassembled on the inside of the oud
body as the complete rosette is has a larger diameter than the sound hole and glued together.
The rosette was then suspended in the manner shown possibly during this assembly process also, to allow the glue to dry before resticking the rosette
to the underside of the sound hole. Allowing the rosette to dry like this meant it would not stick to the inside of the oud.
This sounds to me like a convoluted and highly unlikely stab in the dark but its my best shot after a vey loooong week.
Cheers
Leon
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alfaraby
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| Quote: Originally posted by Ararat66 | Work needed to be done on a loose/cracked brace and the rosette was removed to gain access to the inside of the bowl. Unfortunately the rosette being
old came apart in the process. So once the work was done inside the oud the broken parts of the rosette were reassembled on the inside of the oud
body as the complete rosette is has a larger diameter than the sound hole and glued together.
The rosette was then suspended in the manner shown possibly during this assembly process also, to allow the glue to dry before resticking the rosette
to the underside of the sound hole. Allowing the rosette to dry like this meant it would not stick to the inside of the oud.
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I'd bet on that !
This is exactly what I was about to say, but Leon just stated it much better than I could have done with my poor English !
Yours indeed
Alfaraby
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alfaraby
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Excuse me; but in Arabic we use to write Dr. with an O betweeb the T & R.
دكتـور
Just to let you know !
Yours indeed
Alfaraby
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fernandraynaud
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The two new pieces of soundboard at the soundhole''s edge were not likely removed to let the Shamsa pass, as it looks bigger than the passage so
created.
Richard has a sort Sherlock Holmes mentality, so he would not include a detail that's not relevant. Detective work is like oud-repair, the trick is to
tie the pieces together, come what may. It would seem impossible to guess why the rosette was removed, but again the DrOud principle of unwasted
information suggests that the answer lies before us.
Of course it's not impossible that he has strayed a little from all principles, and that in this case the instrument is not even an
oud. I therefore propose that it was a multi-neck "Saroud" being repaired by a blind upholsterer from Cairo, after Edward Powell dropped it with the
superglue still tacky, in that lonely apartment on the outskirts of Cairo. Those who "keep up with the Mike's Oud Forum" will remember that heat and
humidity caused the original implosion of the instrument while a routine repair (or was it a Taqsim?) was about to be performed.
The combination rear-view-mirror-taxi-deodorizer-varmint-repellent hanging in the oud (misidentified as a "rosette" by many) was meant to prevent the
animal tragedy that occurred in April, while the two new soundboard chips are part of an extremely ambitious and costly "double whammy Turkish
soundboard" type upgrade, having nothing to do with the original structural collapse, but done entirely with authentic Dassault Nomex helicopter
parts, and that is as yet incomplete (as of the photo DrOud provided) (3/2010).
Images of the chain reaction galloping catastrophe that befell the instrument (and most of the attending personnel, and their families) between March
and May 2010, including the April Animal mishaps, and night-vision footage of the memorable Animal-Activist rescue, will be unveiled as soon as I am
awarded the misspelled Risha for correctly identifying the oirginal repair as "just the inevitable routine neck job to lower the action, on both
necks". 
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Reda Aouad
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Fernandraynaud,
If that's the case, I will send you a risha (autographed by me  ) as a
gift
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Sazi
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What the heck, he deserves one anyway, it was a great read, true or not
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Ararat66
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Ahh elementary my dear Udis
Here's a second guess and second guesses may not count - ok here goes ... the face needed repairs at the cracks around the sound hole. The
contraption supporting the fragile rosette is set up and the string threaded through the rosette. The rosette is carefully removed and the thread
means it can't fall into the bowl risking a breakage. Then the repair to the soundboard is done and this is where we are waiting for the glue to dry
on the sound board whilst the rosette hangs awaiting to be glued into back place.
Not as good as your Fernand
Leon
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ALAMI
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My guess is that the important part in the question is the "why", and I think that the why is the the dreadful buzz caused by the vibrating rosette
and that's "why" it needed to be detached and reglued.
But Fernand's version of the facts remains the best.
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MatthewW
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further to Fernand's expert analysis of the situation, I would like to put forward the premise that in the process of this repair Dr Oud is going to
also place a new label with his photo into the oud, hence the need to have the shamsa out of the way. regards, MW
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Dr. Oud
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Location: Sacramento, CA, USA
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| Quote: Originally posted by Reda Aouad | Michael the rosette is a 100-year old. He can't be installing it. And the oud is old he can't be building it. And he can't install a rosette without
removing the face because he won't be able to get it inside (I guess).
Is the rosette broken and you glued it? (But in that case your contest would be too easy) |
We have a winner! well, actually I'm awarding three mizrabs.
1. Reda guessed that the rose is being glued.
2. Michael (bibo10) noticed the crack in the rose.
3. fernandraynaud deserves one for the most original and creative guess even if it is wrong.
The winners can send me their shipping address in U2 or to
droud2002@yahoo.com
The complete story is that the old horn rose broke while removing it for brace repair. If I glued it together outside the face, I couldn't get it back
inside, even thought the edge was broken it still wouldn't fit. If I tried to glue it to the face, I didn't expect that I could align it accurately.
So the suspension jig is actually a third hand, holding the rose up so I can secure it with one hand while positioning the broken piece with the other
(I used forceps and tweezers). Gap filling cyanoacrylate (crazy glue) was used, with a drying agent applied when in position.
now wasn't that fun?
Thanks to Alfaraby for the Arabic spelling correction, I was using the Farsi spelling, which has no "o".
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Reda Aouad
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Thanks Dr. Oud
It was really fun guessing.. especially for me as an ignorant in these matters. And I surely learned a lot from you and the members who tried to
guess. I propose you always do such contests (but surely with no prizes).
Thanks again for the risha
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Ararat66
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Leon
I just love problem solving - I think there are some of us that just have a Sherlock Holmes gene it just gets our brain cells buzzing - lovely
detective work well done folks - otherwise it has been a seriously odd day ... long story!!!
Leon
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