Yaron Naor
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Pegs making on a lathe with duplicator?
Hey all,
Does any one can help me understand how a lathe pattern follower/duplicator exactly work? a step by step how to build one?
I need to produce a set of Lute/Oud/Baroque guitar pegs of my own design and I want to make them on my lathe almost the same pattern.
I googled this subject and found some images but those are not enough to build one for me.
Thanks in advanced
Yaron Naor
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jdowning
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Hi Yaron - a duplicator lathe for making pegs is basically simple in concept but the design details for conversion will depend upon the kind of lathe
that you own. The starting point is essentially a metal turning lathe (rather than wood turning) that has a precision 'cross slide' as well as a
precision longitudinal traverse. What do you have to work with?
I make my pegs on a precision metal turning lathe but with shaped profile cutters - this being a much simpler/more economic set up than offered by a
profile cutting lathe - particularly if you are not intending to go into peg mass production (Hundreds + of one style).
Of course a computer controlled CN lathe would be ideal - but most of us do not have that option - although prices for this equipment are becoming
more competitive in recent years for smaller machines.
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Yaron Naor
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Quote: Originally posted by jdowning  | Hi Yaron - a duplicator lathe for making pegs is basically simple in concept but the design details for conversion will depend upon the kind of lathe
that you own. The starting point is essentially a metal turning lathe (rather than wood turning) that has a precision 'cross slide' as well as a
precision longitudinal traverse. What do you have to work with?
I make my pegs on a precision metal turning lathe but with shaped profile cutters - this being a much simpler/more economic set up than offered by a
profile cutting lathe - particularly if you are not intending to go into peg mass production (Hundreds + of one style).
Of course a computer controlled CN lathe would be ideal - but most of us do not have that option - although prices for this equipment are becoming
more competitive in recent years for smaller machines. |
Thanks John,
I have a big massive metal lathe with lots of cutters and all the skills needed of making the jig, I need to know how it works, and a step by step
images of the technic.
No thinking of mass production, just for my own use, lutes - 13or more pegs...
Thanks,
Yaron.
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jdowning
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I have attached a schematic sketch of how a basic duplicator lathe works - based upon a small sized metal working lathe. If your lathe is large it may
not be suitable for conversion.
A steel template of the peg profile is mounted at the back of the lathe so that the outline can be traced with follower A attached to the rear of the
lathe cross slide. Follower A is set up to be in alignment with the cutting tool B. The screw feed of the cross slide is disengaged so that the cross
slide can be moved in and out by hand. The longitudinal traverse of the lathe table may be moved using the lead screw of the lathe (rotated by hand)
or the lead screw may also be disengaged and the table simply moved back and forth by hand.
For best cutting efficiency the lathe needs to be run at the fastest speed
The concept is simple but the detail design would have to be worked out yourself according to the lathe dimensions. I do not have any step by step
images to offer as I have never been motivated to construct a copying lathe even though I must have made several hundred pegs of various designs over
the years.
If you only need to make a dozen or so pegs this would best be done freehand on a simple wood turning lathe. It is no more complicated than turning
small spindles. Even if you have no prior experience of turning pegs by hand the technique is easily learned, allows full flexibility in peg design
and it would still be much quicker than designing, fabricating, modifying and setting up a duplicator lathe.
Alternatively you might want to try using profiled cutting tools in an unmodified metal cutting lathe. I discuss this procedure on page 41 of this
forum under the topic "More Making Pegs".
Good luck.
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Yaron Naor
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Location: Bat Hefer, Israel
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| Quote: Originally posted by jdowning | I have attached a schematic sketch of how a basic duplicator lathe works - based upon a small sized metal working lathe. If your lathe is large it may
not be suitable for conversion.
A steel template of the peg profile is mounted at the back of the lathe so that the outline can be traced with follower A attached to the rear of the
lathe cross slide. Follower A is set up to be in alignment with the cutting tool B. The screw feed of the cross slide is disengaged so that the cross
slide can be moved in and out by hand. The longitudinal traverse of the lathe table may be moved using the lead screw of the lathe (rotated by hand)
or the lead screw may also be disengaged and the table simply moved back and forth by hand.
For best cutting efficiency the lathe needs to be run at the fastest speed
The concept is simple but the detail design would have to be worked out yourself according to the lathe dimensions. I do not have any step by step
images to offer as I have never been motivated to construct a copying lathe even though I must have made several hundred pegs of various designs over
the years.
If you only need to make a dozen or so pegs this would best be done freehand on a simple wood turning lathe. It is no more complicated than turning
small spindles. Even if you have no prior experience of turning pegs by hand the technique is easily learned, allows full flexibility in peg design
and it would still be much quicker than designing, fabricating, modifying and setting up a duplicator lathe.
Alternatively you might want to try using profiled cutting tools in an unmodified metal cutting lathe. I discuss this procedure on page 41 of this
forum under the topic "More Making Pegs".
Good luck. |
WOW, this is exactly what I needed!
Thanks a lot, I will think about it, make some sketches and then I will build one
Cheers...
Yaron
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fernandraynaud
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The fantastic gizmo someone should build is a peg-maker (or peg-shaper) that's based on the inexpensive Dremel tool line. The Dremel rotary tool with
many attachments and bits, plus their little drill press, comes to about $150, and many people have them. This is nothing like a heavy-duty lathe, but
it can be turned into all sorts of cutters/shapers/sanders/routers, and it's just right for weekend luthiers.
On the photo A is part of the basic tool set, B is the little drill press (and C is misc electronics ;-)
A peg reamer costs $35-$65, and an adjustable peg shaver $50-150. That's expensive, especially if you only need to work on a single set of pegs.
Many people already have the tool - it can act as a sander, plane, drill, cutter - and the little drill press is only about $35. It can hold the tool
on its side as well.
If there was some way to make the Dremel do part of the job, maybe with a simple jig that would hold a peg at an angle to match the taper, one could
turn the peg by hand and use the Dremel in its "drill press" to traverse and shave the peg, that might be a nice way to avoid buying more single-use
tools.
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Yaron Naor
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Location: Bat Hefer, Israel
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| Quote: Originally posted by fernandraynaud | The fantastic gizmo someone should build is a peg-maker (or peg-shaper) that's based on the inexpensive Dremel tool line. The Dremel rotary tool with
many attachments and bits, plus their little drill press, comes to about $150, and many people have them. This is nothing like a heavy-duty lathe, but
it can be turned into all sorts of cutters/shapers/sanders/routers, and it's just right for weekend luthiers.
On the photo A is part of the basic tool set, B is the little drill press (and C is misc electronics ;-)
A peg reamer costs $35-$65, and an adjustable peg shaver $50-150. That's expensive, especially if you only need to work on a single set of pegs.
Many people already have the tool - it can act as a sander, plane, drill, cutter - and the little drill press is only about $35. It can hold the tool
on its side as well.
If there was some way to make the Dremel do part of the job, maybe with a simple jig that would hold a peg at an angle to match the taper, one could
turn the peg by hand and use the Dremel in its "drill press" to traverse and shave the peg, that might be a nice way to avoid buying more single-use
tools.
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Thanks, but I don't see any peg duplicator or something else regarding my question, can you show or give a specific link?
Yaron
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fernandraynaud
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Yaron, you were asking about using a lathe. There are many tool-builders on this forum, so I was suggesting a happy little project for one of them
 and also reminding people about the Dremel .
Maybe someone will have a brainstorm while thinking about the lathe approach.
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Yaron Naor
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Location: Bat Hefer, Israel
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| Quote: Originally posted by fernandraynaud | Yaron, you were asking about using a lathe. There are many tool-builders on this forum, so I was suggesting a happy little project for one of them
and also reminding people about the Dremel .
Maybe someone will have a brainstorm while thinking about the lathe approach.
|
I don't mind to use a Dremel for this issue but can you explain how to make it with a Dremel? images? link?
Thanks
Yaron.
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fernandraynaud
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I cannot possibly show you details, as such a thing has never been made. There's a rough idea, and maybe it could be made.
The general concept is that the little Dremel drill press can be set to a small angle relative to vertical. This angle determines the final taper of
the peg. It can be copied from a model peg by placing model peg in fixture and a blunt bit placed in Dremel tool. As drill press UP_DOWN lever is
actuated, angle can be adjusted for constant clearance from model peg, then drill press set-screw tightened. Then a work peg is placed in fixture. If
the peg can be immobilized in a fixture in a vertical orientation, then the rotating bit in the Dremel with its face at angle theta from vertical will
cut or grind into the work as the drill press lever is moved UP-DOWN, imparting the required taper. The peg must be rotated in the vertical axis for
the cutting bit to work all around the circumference of the peg. The distance of the work peg fixture from the Dremel bit determines the ultimate
diameter of the peg. Something like that.
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Yaron Naor
Oud Junkie
Posts: 275
Registered: 1-24-2009
Location: Bat Hefer, Israel
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Mood: Happy
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| Quote: Originally posted by fernandraynaud | I cannot possibly show you details, as such a thing has never been made. There's a rough idea, and maybe it could be made.
The general concept is that the little Dremel drill press can be set to a small angle relative to vertical. This angle determines the final taper of
the peg. It can be copied from a model peg by placing model peg in fixture and a blunt bit placed in Dremel tool. As drill press UP_DOWN lever is
actuated, angle can be adjusted for constant clearance from model peg, then drill press set-screw tightened. Then a work peg is placed in fixture. If
the peg can be immobilized in a fixture in a vertical orientation, then the rotating bit in the Dremel with its face at angle theta from vertical will
cut or grind into the work as the drill press lever is moved UP-DOWN, imparting the required taper. The peg must be rotated in the vertical axis for
the cutting bit to work all around the circumference of the peg. The distance of the work peg fixture from the Dremel bit determines the ultimate
diameter of the peg. Something like that.
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Thanks for your sketch and ideas, I'm not sure the Dremel can handle the power needed for this mission.
Yaron.
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fernandraynaud
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There are sharp bits and the Dremel has high speed and reasonable torque. The bigger problem I see is that the little "drill press" is not very
strong, and has a lot of play to set and maintain an accurate angle.
Another issue is the peg fixture: how to hold the peg relative to the cutter, and how to rotate it. A simple tapered hole sacrifices some of the work
area. This was just a thought.
But maybe someone will think of a good way to do it. The "drill press" can also hold the Dremel on its side. And there are some other attachments. Who
knows. It's certain that more people own Dremels than lathes. It's probably the cheapest power tool with a stabilizing fixture.
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