billkilpatrick
Oud Junkie
Posts: 563
Registered: 1-3-2004
Location: italy
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Mood: what?
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tuning and perfection
this follows on from an earlier, illuminating posting from samir ("making your oud sound like Abadi or FArido") in which he points out that tuning
down a half step can produce wonderful and previously unheard of tones from your oud. another benefit is that it seems to bring the oud more in line
with the range of my singing voice.
this excellent advise presents problems, however when playing ensemble as instinct takes over - particularly during fast, more complex pieces - and i
find myself constantly returning to positions of the former tuning. plus the fact that i've been preoccupied with producing an early, "european"
sound on my oud - whatever that may be ... something between a guitar and lute, no doubt - and the step down, while more fulsome and resonate, still
sounds middle eastern to me.
while searching for alternatives recently, i happened to click here:
http://www.saedmuhssin.com/index.html
this musician and teacher may be familiar to you but - not being a huge fan of arabic music, just the oud that produces it - i was delighted to find
that he'd recommended what seems to be a perfect tuning for my style of play: c - g - d - A - E - C. saed confirms that middle-eastern musicians
sometimes tune down but also points out that transposing can produce situations where there are no open strings in the scale and that this can make
the oud sound dull. i hadn't considered this before - believing it's more macho, somehow, to play closed position scales - but i think, in my case,
he's right.
anyway, i'm always bolder when boldly going where someone else has boldly been before me and seeing "c - g - d - A - E - C" written on saed's site was
like believing. i haven't tried it out with the group yet but it seems to me to be a more comfortable and versitile tuning for the sort of stuff i
play.
thank you samir ... thank you saed.
- bill
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eliot
Oud Junkie
Posts: 252
Registered: 1-5-2005
Location: The Gorges
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Mood: Aksak
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If your string gauges are right and the oud is friendly to the idea, you can do
c- g- D - A - E - low A
And get very full tone bass notes. Great for later period Oum Kalsoum and abd al-Halim Hafiz songs...
Got the idea from Haig Manoukian, played in this tuning for several years on a Turkish-made Sehit oud that is sized more like its Syrian counterparts.
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TruePharaoh21
Oud Junkie
Posts: 789
Registered: 3-17-2003
Location: California, USA
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Mood: Loving the Oud
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Hey everyone,
I always had in mind that perhaps c-g-D-A-E- low B would be the way to go, especially for beginners on the oud. That tuning allows for some sort of
consistency down all of the strings, where placing your finger in the second position two strings down would always be met with it's counter-open
string two strings above it. Farid seemed to play with this tuning (save for the fact that he didn't have the low B; and that he tuned down as stated
above... but the general spacing between the notes match this).
If one were to tune it low A, it would be much more difficult to achieve the D note that follows it, since the spacing between the low A and the E is
so much. Also, if we were to tune E-C, then the bass would only really work for 3 notes (not including any of the quarter tones or anything).
These are just my thoughts. I'm sure, in practice, c-g-D-A-E-low A may be very conducive to great playing, and may just take some getting used to.
Also, the tuning on Saed Muhssin's site might similarly be better. It seems as though a lot of single bass strings can present problems when hit too
hard, namely buzzing and such. Perhaps this type of tuning could be a remedy for it, making the oud player less dependent on the bass string to make a
bass sound.
Anyway, tell me your thoughts on this, guys. Sounds very interesting!
TP21
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billkilpatrick
Oud Junkie
Posts: 563
Registered: 1-3-2004
Location: italy
Member Is Offline
Mood: what?
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which is correct: c-g-D-A-E-B or c-g-d-A-E-B? setting proper tone has always been a problem for me ... in many ways.
when i first started out i copied the c-g-d-A-E-B tuning i saw mentioned on a cd by habib guerroumi. it was easy to understand, the finger positions
weren't that difficult and habib's hot licks were all i ever really wanted to do. only problem was the mushy B.
i switched to c-g-D-A-G-D for a while hoping i'd be able to work in more bass notes but i never really got the hang of it.
the c-g-d-A-E-C tuning i saw on saed's site just seemed to be a perfect compromise for the stuff i want to play.
i wish tunings were like sports equipment - i'd endorse this one and maybe earn a little money.
- bill
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
Posts: 2953
Registered: 1-30-2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Mood: Stringish
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I think it really depends one what you want to play. The low B tuning doesn't seem that practical for playing most Arabic music, which is primarily
in C, D, G, Bb, B-b- and E-b-.
RE: fingering consistency--this seems less important than physical facility. With the low string tuned to D or C, you have exactly the same
fingerings as the D or C string an octave (or 2) up. Being able to play a phrase and support it with the lower strings at the same time is more
helpful than having the notes all be parallel, IMO.
tuning the 5th string to E is pretty nice though, for some things. I could espicaly see it working for an oud duet, where one person plays mostly low
and the other mostly high. Najib Shaheen really likes this tuning for playing taqsim. In that context, the low B makes sense, I think.
I think your teacher is right, Bill--closed position scales are not really what the oud sound is all about. When Arab musicians tune down, then
everything is in the lower keys (say, D bayyati becomes Db bayyati or C bayyati). I hear you about the "macho" thing--as a guitarist, I almost never
play open position scales (though listening to Bill Frisell has changed that somewhat). But look at violin/cello music--most of it is written in keys
that use a lot of open notes on those instruments. It's just more resonant that way. Also, a lot of the characteristic ornaments depend on
particular fingerings, and so are more natural in the typical positions (though since you're not a fan of Arabic music, this may not matter to you).
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