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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1865
Registered: 7-25-2009
Location: San Francisco, California
Member Is Offline
Mood: m'Oudy
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... shine again? put on a little liquid hide glue, it dries glossy  Otherwise,
Dr. Oud can help you with how to refinish the bowl.
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Luttgutt
Oud Junkie
Posts: 578
Registered: 1-10-2009
Location: Norway
Member Is Offline
Mood: Curious
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Do you mean that liquide hide glue works also as polisher?
p.s. Fernandraynaud, thanks for always "beieng there" : )
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hama
Oud Junkie
Posts: 220
Registered: 9-11-2008
Location: United Kingdom/ London
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Mood: No Mood
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I find Fernandraynaud very helpful and very informative in general, i enjoy reading his posts , thanks Fernandraynaud for your contribution.
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Dr. Oud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1370
Registered: 12-18-2002
Location: Sacramento, CA, USA
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Mood: better than before
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so what's the problem? Is there a big patch of finish missing? or just the crack itself? First you have to identify the finish, because some finishes
will not stick to some others. If you want to get into re-finishing, here's a place to start: scroll down to "Items for Luthiers:", then down to "Finish" and read everything. Otherwise, I would suggest using some
guitar or furniture polish on it.
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Luttgutt
Oud Junkie
Posts: 578
Registered: 1-10-2009
Location: Norway
Member Is Offline
Mood: Curious
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Dr. oud, I was very unclear in what I wrote. Sorry about that. (I was just too happy, I guess
Well, the crack is almost invisable and the polish is still there.
But at one place the wood is sticking out. And I am guessing I'll need to sand it (?) And when that is done, I am guessing I'll need to polish it
again. right?
What should I use to sand it? and what to use on the polish?
Dr. oud, thank for the link. I am starting to read it (but I guess it is gonna take me a long while : )
One more thing:
It is two days now since the fix. Can I put strings on?
I am planing to start with Daniel Mari low tention. But should I tune it even lower at the begyning? maybe one note lower? for how long?
One last question (I promise : )
Is it wise to put the strings while the tape is still on the Oud?
Still hoping for your help! 
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Dr. Oud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1370
Registered: 12-18-2002
Location: Sacramento, CA, USA
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Mood: better than before
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Yes, you can string it, and if the glue is 2 days old, remove the tape. I would not sand down the edge sticking up, but add a little filler to level
it out, then finish over it (glue & sawdust or wood filler). Sanding might remove wood and end up with a hole, which is more difficult to repair.
The back is not affected by the string tension unless it is cracked through the tail end block. I can't advise what to use to re-finish it since I
don't know what it is. Read the information. Any furniture or guitar polish is ok for modern oud finishes (lacquer or varnish). If you test it and it
is a French Polish finish (shellac) you can use lemon oil polish to shine it up.
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Luttgutt
Oud Junkie
Posts: 578
Registered: 1-10-2009
Location: Norway
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Mood: Curious
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Thanks a millon, Dr.oud!
I'm still reading : )
And I'll follow up on your advise!
I owe you a big one :-)
p.s. I promise pictures as soon as possible.
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1865
Registered: 7-25-2009
Location: San Francisco, California
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Mood: m'Oudy
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Luttgutt, in part I was just kidding you, because hide glue being so glossy takes care of itself in that way, if you had used it
Touching up the finish is a big headache, you start in an area and can't find a good way to stop. Maybe you CAN use a little liquid hide glue to even
out and gloss over the repair, it's a lovely glossy amber, I'd have to see how your repair ended up, but you get the idea.
Hama, thanks for the thanks!
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Luttgutt
Oud Junkie
Posts: 578
Registered: 1-10-2009
Location: Norway
Member Is Offline
Mood: Curious
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So you were not totally kiding, after all, Fernandraynaud : )
I failed to mention that this is a floating bridge! Is this a problem (since it is the first rib that was cracked)?
I'll wait to hear from you before I put the strings on..
Thanks again
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1865
Registered: 7-25-2009
Location: San Francisco, California
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Mood: m'Oudy
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You know, I'm an engineer, and I do my own work, so I approach it based on the properties of the materials, how it has worked for me on other
instruments, and so on, and I'm far from being an expert on ouds per se. There are people here who HAVE been working on ouds for a long time and can
tell you what works for them. What Dr. Oud is telling you is not to go crazy with sanding, you will just make matters worse, just try to cover it up.
What I'm suggesting is that the glossiness of hide glue might be exactly what you need to do that. It's just common sense, that as you try to even out
a finish you have big headaches, it never ends short of redoing the whole darned thing. The hide glue, as you will see if you try the liquid stuff, is
very glossy and might help you even it out as a sort of sealer/varnish and maybe save you from having to do a lot of refinishing if the rest of the
bowl is very glossy too. A photo would be very helpful. The only down side of liquid hide glue here, like all hide glue, is that it's warm-water
soluble, so if this is an area where your sweaty hand rests, you will not like it as it may get sticky. Of course the fear of an instrument coming
apart in the rain is absurd, most older instruments are entirely held together with hide glue, and nobody even thinks about it, and you don't
go SCUBA diving with your oud or your violin.
You can try evening out the crack area with a tiny bit of liquid hide glue, sand any aliphatic glue residue before trying to cover it, maybe use a
tiny brush. If you need more opaque "mass" as filler, you can make a paste with glue and sawdust colored to match, and then do the final coat with
just glue for the most shine. If you like it, keep going, and if you don't like it, you can always remove it by softening with warm water and try
another technique. Of course I was teasing you a bit, because as you see, even the simplest things sometimes DO need to be redone, so maybe that would
have been the best glue to use after all. Try to find a bottle of that Titebond Liquid hide glue, it's not very expensive, it's good to have anyway,
it's dated and keeps for about a year. All this talk of it being weak seems to be entirely based on speculation, Titebond's own data shows it as being
just as strong as their best aliphatics. I can't imagine how the type of bridge would have anything to do with it, or why you couldn't be doing this
touch-up with the strings on, but again a photo would be very helpful. I'd hate to imagine you making a hole just to make it flat, or trying to
refinish the whole bowl, try it, and if my idea is bad, it's easy to back out. Make sense?
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