Mike's Oud Forums - Powered by XMB

Oud handmade german style

Hibari-San - 6-5-2015 at 04:29 AM

Hey guys !!

I'm new to this forum and want to say hello :wavey:

I built/restored some instruments before, so I have some experience. The oud is my next personal challenge.
I found a very detailed instruction (in german :buttrock:

!!) and of course I'm building an oud right now.

It would be very cool if some of you guys could give me feedback on my thoughts.

Basically it will be a classic arabic oud construction with a few elements of european luthiery. My target will be to use as less as possible electric mashines.
The oud will come with 19 walnut ribs, spruce top/braces, tineo blocks, walnut neck & palisander peg box/fingerboard.

Some parts are already finished so I will upload some images soon.

Thanks for your attention
bye
Hibari

abc123xyz - 6-5-2015 at 12:50 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

Hey guys !!

I'm new to this forum and want to say hello :wavey:

Hello! Welcome to the forum.

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

I found a very detailed instruction (in german :buttrock:

!!)

Would that instruction happen to be online? If so, could you provide the link?

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

The oud will come with 19 walnut ribs, spruce top/braces, tineo blocks, walnut neck & palisander peg box/fingerboard.

Is tineo the plant described at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weinmannia_trichosperma ?

This is my first time ever hearing of tineo. I'm curious how you came across its wood, and what made you decide to use it, if you don't mind telling :·)

David

Hibari-San - 6-5-2015 at 01:34 PM

Hi David,

are you from germany or able to read german ? (I thought about translating this instruction)
Anyway heres the link

http://www.oudinfo.de/Uberblick/Oudbauen_als_Hobby/oudbauen.htm

Yes thats it ! I think its sometimes called indian apple tree, too. Tineo was my choice for a japanese shamisen that I built some time ago.
I wanted hardness about 1000 lbs (janka) and something exotic. So I ended up with it and it was a pleasure working with it

So my good experiences with it and the fact that I have few pieces laying arround for some years, made me use it for the blocks. (already done)

Maybe its a bit heavy though. :shrug:

Thanks for your interest
Nice day

Hibari

Hibari-San - 6-6-2015 at 10:53 AM

So here are some images like promised.

The blocks are not sanded and i will not smooth em anymore because the glue will stick better.
I made a mistake by placing the screws at the wrong place, so there are 2 holes after screwing back.
But I dont think that this will make any problems. :rolleyes:

I decided to use machine heads on a traditional peg box so the proportions are adapted.

abc123xyz - 6-6-2015 at 11:42 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

Hi David,
are you from germany or able to read german ?

Not me personally, but my family left the Kingdom of Württemberg over a century ago to move to Texas, and I have relatives in München, so I can just barely make out written German.

It was your description of the site as "very detailed" that made me willing to brave the German though, as I'm always eager to dig up any extra nugget of information, no matter where I have to go for it, lol.

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

(I thought about translating this instruction)

I'm sure that would be widely appreciated, as it is a very nice site.

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

Maybe its a bit heavy though. :shrug:

That would be my only concern; they usually make the blocks out of lighter stuff.

Your oud's pegbox has a beautiful curve, by the way.

David

Hibari-San - 6-26-2015 at 02:37 AM

I'm pretty sure there will be be a few frowning on my peg box, but I like it though. I'm still wondering why I ve never seen anything like that, except Mr Naor's.

Anyway I started to build up the body and have glued my very first two ribs :applause:

Hibari-San - 7-6-2015 at 09:49 AM

The body is growing very well. Only 7 ribs remaining.

SamirCanada - 7-7-2015 at 09:01 AM

you are doing very well!

those tuning pegs are as you say controversial. The main drawback is that people find them much heavier and they can throw off the balance of the oud.

Brian Prunka - 7-7-2015 at 09:19 AM

Geared pegs also take longer to tune than friction pegs (due to requiring more turns), though the improvement in stability may make it worthwhile in some cases. Well-fitted friction pegs work very well once you are used to them. There is a much greater learning curve in getting the hang of the pegs . . . which newcomers often consider as an intrinsic flaw rather than just having to learn a new skill.

Nice work overall. I wouldn't want those pegs on my oud, but at least your approach looks fairly unobtrusive. As Samir said, I would be concerned about the weight, though honestly I just have a gut aesthetic reaction as well.

Hibari-San - 7-8-2015 at 10:08 AM

thank you guys for your honest answers !!

Yeah your both right with the extra weight, I realized that quickly after assembling the box.
So I hope at the end it will be balanced due to the heavy blocks, even if the complete Oud will be a bit heavy weight. :rolleyes:

By the way I'm totally familiar with the traditional friction pegs, I get used to it on jap. shamisen and chinese erhu ( which are with 3/2 pegs)
and I have to tune them everytime before I play and sometimes during a session.

So my thought was to be able to play 2 days on one tuning (like my guitar) & I think I can reach that target with those machine heads.

:airguitar:

Can't wait to get it done !

Oh and the next oud will definitely be with traditional pegs.

stos - 7-9-2015 at 03:04 AM

hello!

just to add that it is possible to play two days without tuning again an oud. :cool:

Hibari-San - 7-9-2015 at 03:29 AM

oh really !? that would be very nice because I like the look of the traditional pegs.

I mean if someone could assure me that the pegs have almost the same stability like machine heads,
I would instantly build another peg box for this oud.

SamirCanada - 7-9-2015 at 04:34 AM

As long as the oud in tune with itself...

I mean after the strings have settled on my oud I can sometimes pick it up after 2-3 weeks of not having played and it will still be in tune.

It may not be in tune to play along with other instruments but it will be in tune with itself and that's good enough for me these days.

but yes, I find sometimes up to 4-5 days without tuning is not impossible even when playing along a recording or with a band.

yes the standard oud pegs are actually wonderful when they are properly fitted.

jdowning - 7-9-2015 at 11:48 AM

The stability of the traditional wooden tapered pegs depends a lot on how well seasoned both peg and pegbox woods are as well as their quality and suitability for the application - strong, hard, close grained, straight grained woods (such as fruit woods like plum) being best for the pegs. Boxwood can be good for pegs but it takes forever to season properly.

The pegs must be uniformly smooth and well fitted i.e. with a tighter fit at the larger shank diameter side of the pegbox than at the smaller end. With shallow tapered shanks (30:1) pegs are less likely to 'pop out' with humidity changes than steeper tapered shanks often used by oud makers (16:1 say). Smaller diameter peg shanks allow for finer tuning.

Besides most luthiers can (or should be able to) make their own wooden pegs and so ensure tight quality control over manufacture.

Hibari-San - 7-10-2015 at 09:45 PM

Thank very much guys for the detailed explanations !!

I admit I didn't knew about oud pegs being so stable, although I'd be able to produce oud pegs I prefer to buy them.

I will build a new peg box & neck.

So thanks again !!

jdowning - 7-11-2015 at 03:31 AM

It is perhaps worth noting also that the wood of the sides of the pegbox should be a bit softer than the wood of the pegs so that it will yield slightly under compression to afford a tighter, smoother grip on a peg once the peg has been 'bedded in'. This is also the basic principle applied to engineering plain journal bearings where a hard steel shaft runs in a softer bronze bearing.

Lubrication (dry soap) of the peg bearing surfaces may also help smooth peg action if required.

Hibari-San - 7-13-2015 at 06:24 AM

Alright thank you so much Mr Downing, but its just illustrated reversed in my instruction.
It says the peg box itself, has to be as hard as the pegs or harder to avoid the pegs to "scuff" into the wood. (sry for my engl.)
So now I have both made of palisander the box and the pegs.

I hope I dont have to build a third peg box for this one oud.

jdowning - 7-13-2015 at 01:48 PM

Good luck!

Hibari-San - 7-15-2015 at 07:09 AM

Thanks !

Can somebody please tell me why the oud does not come with a clasp at the bowl end nowadays ?
I almost finished the bowl (last 2 ribs) and its time to plan the mirror, but then I stumbled over the clasp bowl end in Mr Downings "Old Oud-New Project" - oud.
http://www.mikeouds.com/messageboard/viewthread.php?tid=8488&pa...

I'm also familiar with this part on mandolines & lutes, but wondering if there would be some disadvantage
if built on an oud bowl end.

Hibari-San - 7-21-2015 at 07:03 AM

Hey guys,

the body of the oud is finished and the clasp is attached.
Due to my failure of not correctly following the molds markings the body turned out larger than it should be.

At the widest section it measures about 43 cm !!!!
It gets even worse :applause:

the high quality spruce top I wanted to build in, doesn't fit that gargantic body.
So I'm forced to use lesser quality one which I have laying around.

After all this oud turns more and more "controversial"

so I decided to use the controversial peg box as well.
(after finishing the proper peg box) :mad:

Hopefully the next oud will get more traditional.

Images to follow...

Hibari-San - 7-22-2015 at 08:37 AM

jdowning - 7-25-2015 at 11:57 AM

Non conformance with the mold is a common problem for first time oud/lute bowl builders (I call it 'ballooning' - a cumulative error due to the ribs not being fitted in contact with the mold profile as work proceeds resulting in a wider bowl than planned).

If you want to make use of that high quality spruce top you could always glue strips of extra material to the edge of the blank cut from your lesser quality sound board material ('cheeks'). Widening a sound board in this manner is common traditional practice found on both lutes and ouds. Indeed sound boards made up from multiple strips (up to 6 in some cases) are found on some of the old high quality ouds. Two piece sound boards is a relatively modern concept promoted by the luthier supply industry.

The clasp looks a bit on the heavy side to me so should be tapered towards the extreme ends so that it blends with the ribs and does not create a step in the sound board profile.

Nice precise workmanship.

Hibari-San - 7-25-2015 at 02:48 PM

Ah thank you Mr Downing !! I'm relieved to hear that "ballooning" is nothing new.

Yes, the problem why I still cannot use the selected top is that they're different types of wood. The high grade is sitka (AAA) and the lower one is engelmann (A) spruce which is much brighter than the other. But I'm almost done with the engelmann top, the other one has to wait for the next oud.

Multiple sound boards sounds plausible for old ouds, I think it was hard enough to get slow growing spruce wood back then. Especially in the oriental regions.

I will follow your advice for the clasp, besides I now found an earlier thread from theodoropoulos where you explained how to proceed.

Thank's again for taking the time and helping me out !

jdowning - 7-25-2015 at 04:46 PM

There was never a problem for early European luthiers, be they lute or violin makers, to obtain the highest quality sound board woods. The woods cut in the Alpine districts were selected during the winter period when the logs were being slid down the mountains in ice chutes. The best logs were identified as they would 'sing' due to friction induced vibration as they moved and were marked for distribution the luthier trade. The manufacture of instruments such as lutes and violins was big business by the 16th and 17th C. Such timbers would also have been exported from Europe via the established Mediterranean trade routes if not otherwise available within the forests of the Ottoman Empire.
So the multiple piece sound board was unlikely to be due to a shortage of high quality wood in earlier times but must have been a deliberate action by the great luthiers (such as the Nahats) to create sound boards with better acoustic properties than is possible with a one or two piece soundboard (wood can vary a lot even within the same tree cross section).

Today - unlike in the pre-industrialised eras - high quality sound board material is increasingly difficult to obtain due to over harvesting of the old forests and much, I suspect, is now sold sawn from logs without concern for avoiding grain 'runout' (due to spiral tree growth) and then graded mostly on cosmetic appearance. A good time to reintroduce multiple piece sound boards perhaps?

Note that the sound boards of early lutes were not made from spruce (particularly North American Sitka spruce!) but from species of true fir. I am not sure but the early ouds may have had cedar sound boards (not North American Western Red!) - species such as Cedar of Lebanon once available as high quality wood in those days before the ultimate devastation brought about by centuries of overharvesting and consequent disease.
The early luthiers are to be envied for their choice of woods!

Your oud should sound just fine with its spruce sound board.

Hibari-San - 7-26-2015 at 06:26 AM

Oh wow ! Thats quite a lesson in luthier history.
I heard about luthiers/builders behavior is the same like gold diggers, if they find a source of affordable, high grade sound board material, they keep a close secret.
So I should be lucky to live in germany/austria, we have extra slow growing spruce tree in the cold mountains, which provides one of the best woods for sound boards
in world. Although I only used american spruce till now, because I want to increase my skills first.

Btw today I attached the neck to the bowl. Seems working nicely.

Brian Prunka - 7-26-2015 at 07:20 AM

Although not myself a luthier, I find jdowning's assessment quite convincing.
Many of the best ouds I've ever played had multiple-piece soundboards. I don't think that this was because they couldn't get big enough pieces. Also notable is that very tight grain is rare. Again, I doubt that this is because tight grain was unavailable.

jdowning - 7-26-2015 at 11:32 AM

Although now a bit off topic this earlier discussion on multiple piece sound boards may be of general interest.

http://www.mikeouds.com/messageboard/viewthread.php?tid=12601

As well as how to select the potentially best sound board material with low cost test equipment

http://www.mikeouds.com/messageboard/viewthread.php?tid=12819#pid87...

Brian is right - tight straight grain, colour and other cosmetic features of wood alone do not necessarily make an acoustically 'good' sound board material.
As I recall one of the images of multiple piece sound boards of the Nahat family ouds posted on Richard Hankey's website shows some very crooked (longitudinal grain) - no doubt deliberately intended as a decorative feature - as that part of the sound board is glued over the neck block so does not participate in the sound board vibration characteristics. Crooked longitudinal grain is not the same as detrimental grain runout due to spiral tree growth that is probably impossible to detect visually in a thin sawn sound board blank.

See Abdo Nahat 1906 fingerboard, third image here

http://www.droud.com/Abdo.html

Hibari-San - 8-2-2015 at 09:35 AM

After attaching the neck with a regular dowel I started with the sound board.

It will be an engelmann spruce top with one sound hole, without a rosette (for the first oud). I made a more or less standard inlay.
Note that it's not done with finishing yet.

Hibari-San - 8-2-2015 at 09:54 AM

Any hints would be very appreciated before I go into bracing the sound board.

Hibari-San - 8-6-2015 at 09:25 PM

I finished the sound board (2-2.3mm) with the bracing and pick guard.

The pickguard (0.3mm) is palisander to match the peg box and later finger board & bridge.

SamirCanada - 8-7-2015 at 05:17 AM

because your braces are quite thin on the edges, I would go with a half binding if possible.

it is a beautiful job on the bracing and I think it should sound very good.

Jason - 8-7-2015 at 12:05 PM

Looking really nice. How heavy are the mechanical tuners now that you have them attached?

jdowning - 8-7-2015 at 04:21 PM

Nice work. Did you make the sound board with 4 pieces or are what seem to be added side pieces just an illusion due to a colour stripe in the wood grain?

majnuunNavid - 8-7-2015 at 07:09 PM

I like the single sound hole, and the risha guard is tasteful.

Hibari-San - 8-7-2015 at 09:43 PM

Thank you guys !

I really appreciate your compliments.

Samir, even if they look a bit thinner than they really are I'm thinking about making a half binding.
It seems like that but, do you know if a half binding is a more stable construction ?
Yesterday I mounted the board to the body and it fitted surprisingly well (before fixing it with glue).

There's no doubt that these machine heads bring weight to neck.
Unfortunately I missed to weigh a single head.
In spite of the extra weight it doesn't feel like the oud is unbalanced, although I never had another oud in my hands.
I'll be able to compare it when I built a classic style peg box oud.

Hibari-San - 8-7-2015 at 10:25 PM

Thank you Mr. Downing !

Indeed it is an illusion.
It's a regular two piece book matched sound board.
As I mentioned before it's a non-high grade board, which contains these color stripes.
In this case I'm happy with it, the grain is not to irregular, becomes quite tight in the middle and
it could be much worse

I'm glad you like it majnuunNavid ! Is it possible to say what type of oud (egypt,arab etc.) it will represent regarding the single sound hole and an extended finger board ?

Hibari-San - 8-7-2015 at 11:43 PM

By the way, if anyone could provide the measurements of a bridge, I would be very happy.

I would like to compare, so far I found out for my oud:

string attachment post (?)
length: minimum of 10cm
with: 1cm
height: 1.5cm

The distance between each course and each string would be interesting too.

The string height at the bridge should be about 9mm(?)
Please feel free to correct my data !!

jdowning - 8-8-2015 at 03:44 AM

OK, I see that now from the previously posted image of the untrimmed sound board blank. The irregular bacterial stain in the grain of a sound board, of course, has no effect on the goodness or otherwise of the material - it is just one of those cosmetic features included in the luthier trade grading practices - presumably because the consumer public demands it? An excuse to jack up the price of an equivalent piece of wood that does not have stain!

You can always add a rosette at a later date if desired (without having to remove the sound board) by incorporating a slot or equivalent space in the edge of the rosette pattern. However, the presence or otherwise of the rosette makes little if any difference to the acoustics. It is the sound hole diameter to bowl air volume that matters.

Coming from the European lute culture the only traditional choice for edge treatment of a sound board is 1) no binding, 2) no binding but with the edge protected with a glued on strip of fabric or parchment, 3) half binding.
I am not sure when the full depth edge tile arrangement found on present day ouds came into being but it seems to me to be an inferior arrangement compared to half depth binding (both from a strength and ease of execution perspective) - although forum member ALAMI recently reports that he has an older oud that is completely missing its full depth binding and yet still produces a good sound!

Hibari-San - 8-10-2015 at 10:18 AM

Thank you Mr. Downing for another post of great value !

I really hoped by myself about stains on sound boards wouldn't be so much of disadvantage.
Now I have prove.

Nice to hear that the rosette can be added later, but for this oud I will leave it like that. (I think :rolleyes:

)

It is really interessting that bindings of instruments differ so much.
I'm familiar with full depth bindings on guitars and mandolins and did recognize that some of them are those kind of wedge bindings. Which seems to be full depth binding but is actually half.

Another way is that often seen binding on guitars which includes a half binding.
Like on the picture below an outside binding is covering the half binding.
This seems to be a very stable way to bind.

Right now I don't really know which one I will choose for the oud.

jdowning - 8-11-2015 at 03:36 AM

Traditionally ouds (and lutes) did not have modern guitar like internal kerf linings. The edges of the sound boards were glued directly to the outer ribs that might be less than 2 mm in thickness.
Be careful not to build an oud that is more akin to a guitar in construction and sound. This is how the modern revival lutes at the beginning of the 1960's were first being made - non authentic, heavily built and strung to enable classical guitar players like Julian Bream to switch between guitar and lute without changing technique - and producing enough volume to be heard by a moderate sized audience. I doubt if any of those lute like guitars are being played these days?

Hibari-San - 8-12-2015 at 01:57 AM

Actually you're right. I already got this advice from a friend who said that I have to stick with oud construction and not mix it so much with guitar or else.

I will make a half binding today.

Hibari-San - 8-14-2015 at 06:09 AM

The half - binding went surprisingly well !!!

I choosed the binding material so that it looks like the "rib pattern" is continued. It was nice to see that my plan worked for me.
Pictures below showing the walnut - maple binding with the half spruce top looking like the other maple blades between the actual ribs.

SamirCanada - 8-14-2015 at 06:23 AM

Great work. so clean!

What tools did you use to perform the rabbet?

Microber - 8-14-2015 at 10:33 AM

Very nice !

Hibari-San - 8-15-2015 at 07:40 AM

Thank you guys !

I used a dremel tool. But had to cut it "per hand" with a sharp razor at both neck ends which worked as well.
There's still a tollerance of +- 0.5 mm.

Today I attached the finger board and the necklace. Pictures will follow.

Hibari-San - 8-16-2015 at 12:00 AM

Here are the pictures.
Note that only the peg box, neck, fingerboard are already finished and highlighted now.

The bridge as well.

Hibari-San - 8-17-2015 at 05:55 AM

I still need the height of the strings at the nut & Bridge. Highly appreciated if anyone could help me please.

jdowning - 8-17-2015 at 06:15 AM

As you have a guitar style raised fingerboard the best plan might be to intal the nut (or a temporary nut) at the correct string height (1 mm or so) above the fingerboard surface. Run a string - tied to one of the 'pegs' - over the nut and pull it tight. Lower the string at the bridge position until the string action or height above the fingerboard surface at the neck joint is where you want it (2.5 mm or so). Use a narrow strip of wood of that thickness as a gauge. Then just measure the string height above the sound board at the bridge position to determing the height to drill the string holes.
Or use a straight edge in place of a string.

Note that if your bridge tie block is high enough there will be some (small) scope to increase action by 'pulling up' the strings tied to the bridge if required.
String height at the nut may be lowered by filing the string grooves a bit deeper - or increased by placing a wooden veneer shim under the nut.

Hibari-San - 8-18-2015 at 01:07 AM

Alright, thank you so much Mr Downing ! Thats exactly what I wanted to know.
It is of great value to have someone with your skills and knowledge always willing to help out others.

SamirCanada - 8-18-2015 at 05:12 AM

An ideal string height for me is 1.2 cm at the bridge. I would not go lower than 1cm. It leaves enough room for the risha to operate freely.

that fingerboard is very thick! I would make the bridge as it should be and then remove material from the fingerboard as necessary.

Hibari-San - 8-18-2015 at 09:21 AM

Ah ok Thanks ! The finger board is about 3.5 mm thick. Do you think it is to much ? I'm able to compare to mandolins & guitars but have no idea how an elongated oud finger board should be like.

I know that some luthiers make it inlay but I wanted it on top.

SamirCanada - 8-18-2015 at 11:14 AM

Well its not a common thickness.

I would stick to 2mm myself at most. But really it depends on the angle of you neck, is your fingerboard 3.5mm from start to finish or is there a slope?

maybe brush up on the trigometrics, if your string height is about 1.2 cm and you are aiming for about 3mm string height at the neck joint will it work? I don't know, it depends... is your neck is bent backwards a few degrees or is it straight?

but the good thing is since you have a lot of material, you can always remove it until the strings are at the right height.

Hibari-San - 8-23-2015 at 03:30 AM

The fingerboard has 3.5mm overall thickness. The neck is straight and after I put on a string to test the height it came out that everything works fine !!

The strings at the nut are about 1mm above the board, at the neck joint 2.5-3mm and the bridge 1cm, tied to the block maybe 1.1cm.
I drilled the holes today and glued the bridge in place. I'll wait for two days before putting strings on.

Finally the oud will get its finish and will be playable next week.

Hibari-San - 8-24-2015 at 11:30 AM

Today I finished the oud !! It turned out very nice, even if its far away from perfect

Tomorrow I will put on the strings and tune it for the first time.
Maybe I let it set for a few days before tuning to full tension.
I think I will go CFADGC.

Here some pictures but high quality ones will follow.

Hibari-San - 8-26-2015 at 12:29 PM

Thanks to all the members on this forum for sharing knowledge and information about the oud and its construction.
Extra "thank you - hugs" going out to the guys who helped me out actively on building this awesome instrument especially Samir and Mr Downing.
As I said there are some small cosmetic mistakes but nothing serious. For my first oud it is more than acceptable.

The sound (I never heard another oud live) is amazing ! Due to the large bowl it has some deep warm bass but also clear mids and heights.
I expected a nice authentic sound and was not disappointed by the result, it sounds like an oud !!!

The tuning is very comfortable with the machine heads. Also the oud finally doesn't feel un-balanced due to them.
I tuned it DGADGC

At last some pictures of the oud in its final shape.
The spruce top has got a wax finish and the body including neck and pegbox has an "superior german wood oil" finish.

These white dots on the neck are just tape to help me get by with fretless playing. :airguitar:

Microber - 8-26-2015 at 12:53 PM

Dear Hibari,

This is a very nice and elegant oud. :applause:

Just a little restriction for me (and I'm sure i'm not the only one) the mechanical pegs.
For the next one, please use wooden pegs.

And it will be perfect.

Robert

jdowning - 8-26-2015 at 02:53 PM

Congratulations and well done on your fine craftsmanship. Enjoy your new oud!

BaniYazid - 8-30-2015 at 06:09 AM

Good job, thank you for sharing the process.
Let us hear the sound when the strings are settled.

Hibari-San - 9-1-2015 at 09:10 AM

Thank you very much guys !!

I'm getting more and more familiar with playing the oud but I do not dare to record my try outs.
Next week a friend will try to play something worth to be recorded, then I can upload a sound file.

Everywhere I looked for strings, a warning advice caught my attention, that one should not tune an arabic oud to turkish tuning.
The instrument can be damaged due to not be created for the tension of turkish tuning.

That completely makes sense for me.
But where is the difference between these ouds in construction ? Is it just the floating bridge or is there anything else like stronger bracing etc.
I would be thankfull if anyone could answer this question.

Btw I purchased three different brands of strings: aquila, pyramid and d'addario.
I will try all of them, but if anyone knows which are the best....

Matthias - 9-1-2015 at 11:02 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

Everywhere I looked for strings, a warning advice caught my attention, that one should not tune an arabic oud to turkish tuning.
The instrument can be damaged due to not be created for the tension of turkish tuning.

That completely makes sense for me.
But where is the difference between these ouds in construction ? Is it just the floating bridge or is there anything else like stronger bracing etc.
I would be thankfull if anyone could answer this question.

The reason is not the construction it is the fact that if you raise the tuning from arabic to turkish tuning the tension will be increased by around 6 Newton per string that means all in all 66 Newton more.
And if you use turkish string sets which have sometimes a higher tension, they are calculated for a turkish scale of 58,5 cm. On a arabic aoud with 60 or more scale you have additionally a raising of the tension.

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

Btw I purchased three different brands of strings: aquila, pyramid and d'addario.
I will try all of them, but if anyone knows which are the best....

This will be a personal preference and also depends from the instrument and how they work on it.

Best regards

Matthias

Hibari-San - 9-2-2015 at 07:14 AM

Hallo Matthias !
Danke für die schnelle Antwort ! :wavey:

So does that mean if I want my next oud with turkish tuning, I just have to give it a shorter scale length ?
Is floating bridge more likely to be with turkish tuning ?

I wish we could meet at the summer music academy, but I have to work even at the weekend.
Anyway I wish you a nice time there !!

Matthias - 9-2-2015 at 12:39 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Hibari-San

I wish we could meet at the summer music academy, but I have to work even at the weekend.
Anyway I wish you a nice time there !!

Thats really a pitty, we have alot of aoud players here and we expect to have Mimmi Peruffo from Aquila as a guest on sunday.

If you get a chance to come, do it, you will not regret it.

See you?

Matthias

rootsguitar - 10-12-2015 at 05:43 PM

great photos & follow through! pleasure to see your work progress & looks very sharp.

hope to hear this oud too